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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Nov 18, 2020 18:01:05 GMT
Cryogenic If you gave me a C grade reply, I'd have been happy, but you went for an A and easily got it, so fair play. That's a really clear ascription. Makes me wonder if you'd make a good book editor? I think you would.
Your latest post on that Lucas Sequel thread has caught me eye. You know, after spotting the the Mark Hamill "warned us x many times" video, and then the infamous White Slaver GL interview, I had my hopes up that I would eventually scroll down to see a big, fat, gorgeous HackFraudMedia review, but alas, it did not appear. 
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Post by Cryogenic on Nov 18, 2020 22:15:13 GMT
Cryogenic If you gave me a C grade reply, I'd have been happy, but you went for an A and easily got it, so fair play. That's a really clear ascription. Makes me wonder if you'd make a good book editor? I think you would. Thanks! I guess it partly comes from writing so much, being so intimately involved in that thread the last few days, and just a general fascination with structure and parsing out certain patterns. Ah! Well, it could have! There was a post where I brought up the Mary Sue thing. If you recall, that review has a wonderful exposition of the Mary Sue trope and how it relates to Daisy Ridley's character. Don't worry. The old Disney basher in me isn't completely dead! |
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Post by smittysgelato on Nov 19, 2020 21:22:17 GMT
Hello Everyone,
My name is Josh. I'm currently fanboying over the fact that a forum titled "Naberrie Fields" is actually a thing! Looking forward to getting to know you all.
-May The Force Be With You.
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Post by Cryogenic on Nov 20, 2020 5:38:33 GMT
Hello Everyone, My name is Josh. I'm currently fanboying over the fact that a forum titled "Naberrie Fields" is actually a thing! Looking forward to getting to know you all. -May The Force Be With You. Ladies and gentleman, boys and girls, and assorted transgender, genderfluid, and non-binary folk: We have an absolute legend in our midst! The mighty smittysgelato!!! This guy, for me, wrote one of the greatest prequel essays of all time. I've been meaning to fashion an elaborate response (kind of like a glorified set of footnotes) to it for some time! I once did, actually: on Naboo News (very long and windy discussion with fellow forum member ArchdukeOfNaboo -- where the essay was mentioned and the scene it describes was discussed in detail). And thank you for liking the forum name, Josh! I came up with it -- kinda! A few of us on another message board ( TheForce.Net) were getting sick of anti-prequel trolling attacks and the authoritarian posture of the moderators on that board. It's one of the greatest places for discussing the prequels, but it is also tainted by a persistent low-level belligerence toward the prequels from some fans, and a moderating force that basically runs a crooked table. So we began a private discussion and the idea of having our own forum came up. We knew we wanted it to be a prequel sanctuary, and we were attracted to the idea of giving it a Naboo-centric theme. Various names were tossed around, like "The Lake Country", "The Lake Retreat", "House Naberrie", and a slew of others. But those, in particular, were some of my favourites, and at some point, "Naberrie Fields" was uttered for the first time. It seemed to stick -- maybe it was The Beatles resonance that did it -- and so the forum was soon created (by our webmaster Subtext Mining ). This was back in early 2017. It was a super-slow place for a few years, with one or two founding members sometimes posting and having a gentle, out-of-the-way discourse; but, I admit, I didn't post back then. A few of us were discussing the films privately on Skype instead in a big group-chat discussion. That was fine and enjoyable for a while. But after being banned from TheForce.Net (or "TFN") in mid-2017, I looked for a new place to engage publicly in prequel positivity, and started to apply my muse to the comment section of a prequel news blog that had not long been incepted: Naboo News. (Recently, alas, the blog was paused, as you can see from the top post). But that had started to grow a bit stale after a couple of years, for me, and I longed to return to a message board environment again. Still banned from TFN and not particularly desiring to return, I finally turned my attention to Naberrie Fields and dragged a few more fans across in the process.  The place has livened up in the last year, but I wish it were livelier! However, seeing your name in the corner of the screen the other day gave me quite the rush. There is still the faint possibility this forum may pick up in the next year or two, and if it does, that would be tremendous. It'll also be thanks, in no small part, to people of your calibre choosing to register and add your voice when you feel inclined! So take a look around and enjoy. You are most welcome. May your time here be a pleasant and fulfilling one. And may the Force be with you. |
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Post by Somny on Nov 20, 2020 6:56:35 GMT
It's always a pleasure when a new member pops up in this little haven, especially someone who's contributed as thoughtfully as you have in the past. I hope you find the time to soak in the amazing content already gathered in our many threads and add to the conversation yourself!
Thanks for joining us and may the Force be with you, too!
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Post by Ingram on Nov 20, 2020 7:23:49 GMT
So we began a private discussion and the idea of having our own forum came up. We knew we wanted it to be a prequel sanctuary, and we were attracted to the idea of giving it a Naboo-centric theme. Various names were tossed around, like "The Lake Country", "The Lake Retreat", "House Naberrie", and a slew of others. But those, in particular, were some of my favourites, and at some point, "Naberrie Fields" was uttered for the first time. It seemed to stick -- maybe it was The Beatles resonance that did it -- and so the forum was soon created (by our webmaster Subtext Mining ). This was back in early 2017. I feel I have to come clean here... There's a running gag in The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai where all the inter-dimensional alien imposters -- Red Lectroids and Black Lectroids both -- assume the first name "John" whilst navigating Earth, incognito. John Gant, John Balook, John Yaya, John Parrot, John Bigbooty (pronounced "Bigboo-tay") etc. Like much of the offbeat absurdism throughout the film, it passes by off-the-cuff, including here:
Every time I visit this forum ...every, single, time... a compartmentalized section of my brain automatically defaults to the above scene. That's all I've got. Make of it what you will.
Oh, and—Hi, Smitty. Zdravstvuyte. This is the kinda stuff you're in for. Good luck.
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Post by Cryogenic on Nov 20, 2020 7:52:52 GMT
So we began a private discussion and the idea of having our own forum came up. We knew we wanted it to be a prequel sanctuary, and we were attracted to the idea of giving it a Naboo-centric theme. Various names were tossed around, like "The Lake Country", "The Lake Retreat", "House Naberrie", and a slew of others. But those, in particular, were some of my favourites, and at some point, "Naberrie Fields" was uttered for the first time. It seemed to stick -- maybe it was The Beatles resonance that did it -- and so the forum was soon created (by our webmaster Subtext Mining ). This was back in early 2017. I feel I have to come clean here... There's a running gag in The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai where all the inter-dimensional alien imposters -- Red Lectroids and Black Lectroids both -- assume the first name "John" whilst navigating Earth, incognito. John Gant, John Balook, John Yaya, John Parrot, John Bigbooty (pronounced "Bigboo-tay") etc. Like much of the offbeat absurdism throughout the film, it passes by off-the-cuff, including here: Every time I visit this forum ...every, single, time... a compartmentalized section of my brain automatically defaults to the above scene. That's all I've got. Make of it what you will. You're bloody hilarious! It resonates, Ingram -- it resonates... I don't think it's much of a secret, but my name is actually John. So, er, yeah... there's that.  Let me take you down 'cos we're going to Smallberries Fields Nothing is real (it's all digital) And nothing to get banned about (unless you're, like, really terrible) Smallberries Fields forever (or until the domain expires or Disney tries to shut us down) |
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Nov 21, 2020 1:05:19 GMT
Do feel welcome to contribute to any thread that you so wish, no matter if it's 20 words in the spirit of Joey or 2,000 word Crogenicesque essays, it's all the same. Don't feel under any pressure to conform to our accepted wisdom on the themes and characters in the PT either - if you happen to see things differently, then please share, and enlighten us. If there's one thing I've gathered from my time on the Star Wars online fandom, it's that there are numerous ways of interpreting the films, though that isn't to imply they're all equally valid either. I look forward to all your Lucas insights.
Cryogenic Cheers for reminding me of that memorable conversation on Naboo News, that sprung out of a news item on a comic book front cover, of all places, but perhaps most appropriately. My SW analysis was indeed at another level back then. |
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Post by Cryogenic on Nov 21, 2020 12:45:33 GMT
Yes, smittysgelato -- thank you! It's rare that we have new and interesting people deciding to join. 2020 has been the busiest year for the boards (the only year you could really, in any way, call busy), but it would be nice if the next two or three could surpass it.
I echo you -- quality paragraph! However, some degree of substance is encouraged of all our members here. I'm not saying anyone has to copy me, however! Variety is the spice of life. And yes, please, by all means: let's all have our own opinions and be true to what we (as individuals) see in these movies and this fabulous saga.
I know the feeling! I think mine was, too. "We lost something."
You did lay down some real quality thoughts there. I'm sure your muse will return!
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Post by smittysgelato on Nov 23, 2020 5:04:57 GMT
I've been lurking on the boards the past few days and have already discovered some resources I was previously unaware of, such as the Defense of the Clones essay by David Begor. That one really ties quite a bit together, now doesn't it? Just a heads up: I'm currently working on a screenplay, so I won't be contributing anything major until my current draft is finished. Lastly, I have a favour to ask. If any of you read my blog post, Prequel Posts #3, there is a reference to something George Lucas said in an interview or a commentary once upon a time. I couldn't remember where it was from, so I just summarized it from memory. If any of you recognize where it is from, or stumble upon it yourself during your travels, I'd love to know where it was from! Thanks. |
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Post by Cryogenic on Nov 23, 2020 5:45:28 GMT
I've been lurking on the boards the past few days and have already discovered some resources I was previously unaware of, such as the Defense of the Clones essay by David Begor. That one really ties quite a bit together, now doesn't it? Ah! I've been tasked with posting my AOTC essay even if it kills me, and that's one of various pieces I've incorporated into my response. It's still one of the greatest pieces on the movie, if you ask me. A couple more used in my response that you might like: wondersinthedark.wordpress.com/2010/04/08/bob-strikes-back-at-attack-of-the-clones-naysayers/brightlightsfilm.com/george-lucass-wildest-vision-retrofuturist-auteurism-star-wars-episode-ii-attack-clones-2002/#.X7tLS2j7SUlAnd were you ever aware of the famous "Lard Biscuit" defence of AOTC? lardbiscuit.com/cinema.htmlAll his Star Wars stuff is there. He started off with a defence of TPM, which is also a good read. But the one you want is The Shroud of the Dark Side. The Begor essay was also one of his reference pieces. Great stuff! I think everyone should work on a project or two -- helps keep one energised and staves off the nihilism. I'm pretty good with Lucas quotes. I'l take a look and get back to you. EDIT: Okay, this part from your essay: I don't know about "boxes of the mind" (but what an awesome term), but I do recall him saying that a major motif in all his films, especially THX, is the idea of people living in prison cells with open doors -- and all they have to do is find the courage to walk out. It must be on the DVD commentary track somewhere (or possibly the supplementary making-of material), according to this page: The novelisation also has a poignant use of the term where THX is apprehended... "gently": |
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Post by smittysgelato on Nov 26, 2020 0:29:24 GMT
Oh my,
I am not familiar with any of that material. This may be a result of the fact that I tend to avoid discussing Star Wars on the internet because it can be so negative.
YES. The idea of a prison with an open door sounds awfully familiar, so that is likely the interview/commentary in question. I listened to several making of features and commentaries from the DVD and Blu-ray when I was doing research for my post, but to no avail. I had to just let it go because otherwise I would have spent too much time trying to find it again.
I swear he said "boxes of the mind" in the same interview though. Unless I got that term from somewhere else and then I related it to Lucas' comments because they are so similar? Who knows.
One day in the future when I'm doing research for something else I will probably stumble upon it again.
Thanks for the help.
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Post by Cryogenic on Nov 26, 2020 6:05:48 GMT
Oh my, I am not familiar with any of that material. This may be a result of the fact that I tend to avoid discussing Star Wars on the internet because it can be so negative. It can be exceedingly and excruciatingly negative. However, in my case, I have tended to embrace the rough and the smooth (admittedly: there's often been more rough), because I like sand, and I like Padme's back... Wait, what? What I mean is, er... Negativity has been less of a deterrent for me than other prequel fans. It makes me roll my eyes half the time, but I was also born to the dark, molded by it. I didn't see the light until I was already a man... I know the feeling! I also have to let quotes go on some occasions, and it absolutely kills me, every time. What often happens is our minds make up a quote by slightly misremembering and generating a brand new term, or substituting one word for another. If you're trying to locate the quote by digital means, you can end up going on a wild bantha chase, because it won't appear in the results (usually), no matter how hard you try. If there were some reliable way to calibrate one's likely degree of wrongness, the world would be a better place. Well, as GL has said, he's (ultimately) a child of the 1960s -- and San Francisco 1960s, at that. Just think of what was on the airwaves back then. Maybe you were thinking of this song: I can offer you another interpretation. Last month, I made a post in one of the board's densest threads that contains an older quote of mine: This motif of needing "breathing room" is all over the PT. The Jedi, for example, evade the Destroyer Droids in the opening sequence of TPM by going up "the ventilation shaft", just as THX escapes the city by making his way through a VAC SHAFT, according to a computer readout: Along with this "boxed-in" motif, there's also the theme of being "mindful", and of not letting negative thoughts control you (e.g., "Your focus determines your reality", "You're focusing on the negative") -- something your Brothers' Farewell essay itself focuses on to beautiful effect. GL probably gave the best exposition of this concept on the TESB commentary track for the Dagobah cave sequence: An earlier draft of the screenplay to the original film also had the following exchange between Luke and Han: So it's possible your mind has conflated pieces like this (themes and motifs organically leap out of these films) and confabulated some new buzz-term that sounds like something Lucas might have said. Of course, I'm not saying he didn't say it. I sense this is going to eat at you for a while. Indeed. That's often how it goes... 'Tis the way of the Force. No problem. |
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Post by smittysgelato on Nov 27, 2020 5:58:43 GMT
I'll take Padme's smoothness over sand any day. (In general, but especially in the context of discussing Star Wars!) I LOVE The Dark Knight Trilogy. Well played reference, sir. I can't wait to see Tenet when the blu-ray drops in December!!! I definitely think it is possible I made up the term "boxes of the mind" by mixing different ingredients. I'm not 100 percent convinced though! "Windmills of the Mind." Well this is COMPLETELY on point. It sounds like Noel Harrison is a William Blake fan. I read Star Wars through the lens of William Blake very much. When I think of the "boxes of the mind" the first association I make is with Blake's "mind forg'd manacles." So yes, I was kind of thinking of the Noel Harrison song, albeit indirectly via William Blake. I've never heard of that song, actually. I'm not well versed in the music scene. Well this just blew my mind. Now I want to go re-watch the movies with all of the above in mind! I knew breathing was a thing in Star Wars, the cross-cutting between Vader's first breath and Padme's last being a prime example, but I never made the connection with ventilation shafts or "breathing room." Given the fact that the Vader suit is a tight space that requires artificial means of breathing, this makes COMPLETE sense. I love that I am already learning new things on this forum. William Blake's poem, Eternity, PERFECTLY sums up Anakin's error in Episode III: He who binds to himself a joy Does the winged life destroy He who kisses the joy as it flies Lives in eternity's sunrise Padme being his joy, of course. And the sunrise, that's none other than the child archetype itself, the sun in his child form. So when Anakin escapes the boxes of the mind in Episode VI, and the suit that is a box itself, he is able to look upon Luke with his own eyes, the eyes of the child gazing wide eyed at eternity's sunrise. |
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Post by Somny on Nov 27, 2020 6:38:46 GMT
William Blake's poem, Eternity, PERFECTLY sums up Anakin's error in Episode III: He who binds to himself a joy Does the winged life destroy He who kisses the joy as it flies Lives in eternity's sunrise Padme being his joy, of course. And the sunrise, that's none other than the child archetype itself, the sun in his child form. So when Anakin escapes the boxes of the mind in Episode VI, and the suit that is a box itself, he is able to look upon Luke with his own eyes, the eyes of the child gazing wide eyed at eternity's sunrise. The like button is not enough. Thanks for this amazing citation and commentary, Smitty! Great artists are always in dialogue with one another, I find. |
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Post by Cryogenic on Nov 27, 2020 12:49:37 GMT
I'll take Padme's smoothness over sand any day. (In general, but especially in the context of discussing Star Wars!) LOL! That's a relief.  I'm actually not a huge Nolan fan, but I appreciate that his films leave a mark. Dangerous and disturbing, this puzzle is... I love that term of Blake's and have used it a few times before. I'm not super well-versed in the music scene, either, but I've known that song for a long time. The 1960s was also the era that gave us this forum name (via The Beatles), and esoteric pop masterpieces like MacArthur Park (I'm also a big Elvis fan and the 1960s is my favourite period in his life and career): Once again, the 1960s was a period of immense artistic experimentation, and without the 1960s, there'd really be no George Lucas and no Star Wars. In many ways, it was the most pivotal decade of the 20th Century (but then, when you look back, they're all important, really). You're too kind! I've actually stolen some of that from forum member Pyrogenic . He took his name in emulation of me, but truth be told: he has probably had a bigger impact on my thinking than vice versa. Years ago, we began discussing some of the themes/motifs of the PT, one-on-one, and he felt (for a time) that a dominant motif of the PT -- maybe even the centralising motif -- was breathing. He ingeniously linked up (if I recall correctly) the Jedi holding their breath when the Trade Federation gasses them in the conference room with Darth Vader's breathing heard at the end of the credits. Characters and ideas needing breathing room is a thematic concern you can tease out by bringing those and other assorted details together. This is a motif you can play around with and apply to the saga entire in a number of interesting ways (for instance: the PT is Vader breathing in, the ST is Vader breathing out). William Blake's poem, Eternity, PERFECTLY sums up Anakin's error in Episode III: He who binds to himself a joy Does the winged life destroy He who kisses the joy as it flies Lives in eternity's sunrise Padme being his joy, of course. And the sunrise, that's none other than the child archetype itself, the sun in his child form. So when Anakin escapes the boxes of the mind in Episode VI, and the suit that is a box itself, he is able to look upon Luke with his own eyes, the eyes of the child gazing wide eyed at eternity's sunrise. The like button is not enough. Thanks for this amazing citation and commentary, Smitty! Great artists are always in dialogue with one another, I find. Prequel fan and author Paul F. McDonald linked that exact verse to the plight and triumph of Anakin many years ago in the following picture essay based on Blake's output: thestarwarsheresies.blogspot.com/2013/02/star-wars-according-to-william-blake.htmlThat same year, he also published a book on the prequels: a philosophical meditation that examines the prequels via its characters and relates them to history, religion, myth, fables, and famous works of literature. The book is divided into three parts, one part for each movie, and there are nine chapters for each movie: an elegant structure. It's probably the best book ever written on the PT. It's highly readable (demotic and conversational rather than dry and academic). I strongly recommend getting yourselves a copy -- you won't regret it! www.amazon.com/The-Star-Wars-Heresies-Interpreting/dp/0786471816Also -- "the child gazing wide eyed at eternity's sunrise" (if we're taking into account all nine films) is, technically, Rey:  This final saga image is actually very evocative of the closing shot of THX-1138: www.reddit.com/r/StarWarsCantina/comments/fv7lbv/the_end_of_the_rise_of_skwalker_is_an_homage_to/Broader set of comparison images here (THX-1138, A New Hope, Raiders Of The Lost Ark, The Force Awakens -- before the ending of TROS was known!): And, of course, one shouldn't forget about the closing shot of the PT:  ROTS: Sunset
TROS: Sunrise |
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Post by Subtext Mining on Nov 27, 2020 13:12:31 GMT
William Blake's poem, Eternity, PERFECTLY sums up Anakin's error in Episode III: He who binds to himself a joy Does the winged life destroy He who kisses the joy as it flies Lives in eternity's sunrise I see that as a excellent, Western, poetic depiction of the Eastern concepts of attachment and non-attachment. And speaking of breathing and things of the mind, I also latched onto these themes and made a (23 min) video on it called Breathing Together. It's centered around the Archetype of the risen, fallen and redeemed hero mixed with Huxley's and Blake's respective takes on the Doors of Perception. If the doors of perception were cleansed every thing would appear to man as it is, Infinite. For man has closed himself up, till he sees all things thro' narrow chinks of his cavern. thesyncbook.com/network/?rtag=syncvideos&id=295 |
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Post by Cryogenic on Nov 27, 2020 15:15:59 GMT
William Blake's poem, Eternity, PERFECTLY sums up Anakin's error in Episode III: He who binds to himself a joy Does the winged life destroy He who kisses the joy as it flies Lives in eternity's sunrise I see that as a excellent, Western, poetic depiction of the Eastern concepts of attachment and non-attachment. I think that's how Paul F. McDonald sees it, too. He comes at Star Wars from that same sort of Neo-Buddhist/Alan Watts angle. That video montage is so beautiful -- seen it before, a pleasure to see it again! I only take issue with one thing: “I declare that The Beatles are mutants. Prototypes of evolutionary agents sent by God, endowed with a mysterious power to create a new human species, a young race of laughing freemen.” -- Timothy Leary I'm weary of Leary! Oh, wait. Beatles are the Four Humours. Elvis is the Star Child. Fixed. Yes -- an amazing quote. I think your video montage already scooped me on this, but here's a quick compilation of "chink" imagery from TPM I rustled up just now:  In an earlier compilation I made some years ago, I gathered together numerous instances of TPM's "splitting door" motif. One day, it really stood out to me how much of an Asian aesthetic TPM has, even down to its many horizontally-parting entrance/egress points and barriers -- elegant partitions from a more civilised age:  |
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Post by smittysgelato on Dec 8, 2020 3:14:05 GMT
I'm glad you enjoyed the citation from Blake, it blew my mind when I connected the dots on that one! (Star Wars blows my mid A LOT). I remember when I first made the connection between Star Wars and Blake (sometime in 2018 or 19?), I thought to myself: "surely someone else has realized this before because both Star Wars and Blake are absolutely legendary. I can't be the only one." I've actually heard of Paul's book before, but never got around to reading it. I wasn't aware of his picture essay on Blake, though. That thing is amazing. I wonder if he was an English major like I was, that would explain a lot! I have a feeling his book is going to be a lot of my own thoughts boiled down and organized with more clarity than I could muster myself! Ohhhhh. So that's why Luke exhales a sigh of relief after landing his shot on the Death Star. It isn't just a generic sigh of relief, he has just escaped the tight space that is the Death Star trench, and defeated the oppressive Empire, so he is able to breathe again.  Yes, Rey is literally gazing into eternity's sunrise, BUT....Like I said, the sunrise is the sun in its child form. Luke is the sunrise that Anakin is gazing into, wide-eyed, like a child. His literal child brings out the child in him. Thanks for sharing, Subtext! I've added this to my queue. |
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Post by Subtext Mining on Dec 9, 2020 18:17:31 GMT
Oh M-I-D-1E, I'm baa-aack. But this time as an expat.  Ha, now I live one block away from this place. And smittysgelato, in this video around 9:00 Lucas talks about the proverbial "box" that one thinks outside of, quite a bit, that you may have combined with him talking about the drugs in THX, etc. youtu.be/_DByPy8aEPw |
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