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Post by Ingram on Jun 24, 2021 20:24:21 GMT
Walter Hill's Streets of FireFirst of all, Walter Hill in general is in a special category for me, just plain simple. Major WH fan speaking. One part Western the other part Action-Crime-Noir revivalist, his movies are hard boiled and often graceless works of attitude where male heroes speak roughly (or little at all) and women saunter. But like many a filmmakers who came out of the 1970s he too is an homage artist in his own way. The Warriors from 1979 was already his first foray into a kind of graphic comic world of that era's urban gangland psyche, but rolling into the following decade thronged with Lucasberg's B-serialized Star Wars and Indiana Jones, W.D. Richter's take on Doc Savage via The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai and John Carpenter going all yellow peril/wuxia sorcery with Big Trouble in Little China, Hill would likewise embrace the pulp—and that pulp was the 1984 'Rock'n'Roll Fable' as tag-lined on the very poster.  Streets of Fire is also perhaps Hill's most innocent film, with a PG rating rare among his portfolio. No one dies in the film surprisingly while the language is mild. It's for kids, teenagers specifically. It's the ultimate date movie offering in equal measure what young guys and gals desire on a Saturday night outing sans any heavy investment: guns, motorcycles and street fights -- music, glamor and romance. Heroes, villains, damsels, sidekicks etc. are drafted statements right from the start and brassy dialogue is of such that cuts right to the point of pushing the plot forward while still illustrating whatever the character speaking it. Two aspects of the film in particular strike a relation with the Star Wars Prequels, the first being its world-building. The story is set in an alternate timeline that splices together 1950s rockabilly with a contemporary dimension of 1980s zeroed in on the burgeoning zeitgeist of an MTV pop-video culture; in the fictional city of Richmond (think: vintage steel mill St. Louise, L-train Chicago and Motown Detroit all meshed into one) is where the action takes place loosely to the meter of a diegetic musical. The second link to Lucas' space opera melodrama is, well, the melodrama, for Streets of Fire encapsulates the stuff of unabashed drive-in romance replete with longing looks, wounded feelings and the naked expressions of such through the film's own idiomatic, street-level purple prose. Other broad-yet-potent commonalities may include:
- opening fairy tale text: A long time ago in a galaxy far far away... / Another time, another place...- fictional metropolis coded with "graffiti" distinctly American
- a planetary queen / rock queen as the macguffin - accumulating motley crew of disparate characters
- hindered transports and waylay stations
- revved engines and speeder bikes
- seedy nightclubs
- sledge hammer duel in place of lightsabers - dare I say, a cult following or niche fanbase?
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Post by tonyg on Sept 11, 2021 3:52:03 GMT
For the record, Valerian is based on famous French-Belgian comics that Lucas loved too. Luc Besson wanted to make a movie about Valerian long ago but the technology didn't allow him, the budget too. So there is historical reason for SW and Valerian to look alike.
I liked Valerian, it was a breath of fresh air, the story was a little bit confused and simple in the same time, I think the problem is again that they had plans for sequels and they should exclusively focus in this story that is in the movie.
The other thing that is not in the comics but has interesting parallel with the prequels is Valerian himself. As idea he should be more like Han Solo type, however Besson relied on the Anakin type. It would worked better for me if Besson had rewritten the character (Valerian of the movie looks and acts as sympathetic nerd not as macho badass) to be indeed more like Anakin (not having a list of "chicks", for example, this was out of space for him). Lorelaine (if I spell her name correctly) was more consistent with her actions but in the end, Luc Besson is good in writing about strong female characters who don't act like male imitators (another allusion to PT story).
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Post by natalie on Sept 21, 2021 18:06:37 GMT
What, no love for Alita? Doesn't this give you some prequel vibes?
Like the movie a lot, only felt it was somewhat incomplete - maybe because they adapted just the first mangas and hoped for a sequel?
And speaking of samurai and good manga/anime adaptations, I'm in the middle of watching all Rurouni Kenshin live action movies. I watched the anime series and OVAs many years ago (when Netflix was still a DVD only service) and really like them, especially the origins OVA and the middle ark in the series (the first two seasons were shown on CN I believe). I'll write more once I'm done but at the moment I'm really digging it, they highlighted the best storyline and the characters actually look and act like their anime version, for a change. The cinematography and sword fights are great, of course.
Why does it remind me of the prequels? Probably because, despite the frequent action, it still sets aside time for reflexion... and certain degree of melancholy? The main character (Kenshin) is a former assassin who's sworn off murder but still gets pulled into trouble by various forces which leads to constant moral conundrums. Imagine if Anakin manages to turn back to light before the battle on Mustafar... but loses Padme in the process? What would've his life been like?
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Post by natalie on Sept 25, 2021 0:46:09 GMT
I finished the RK quintet and loved it, would give the whole series A- (minor quibbles with some pacing and how some of the characters were handled). A special shout out to the prequel movie (The Beginning). The original OVA (Trust and Betrayal) is one of the highest rated animation entries ever, so it was a tough act to follow but the movie manages to hold its own. For some reason, Netflix only has the last two movies in the North America but you can rent the first trilogy from services like Amazon.
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Post by tonyg on Sept 25, 2021 21:39:07 GMT
What, no love for Alita? Doesn't this give you some prequel vibes? Like the movie a lot, only felt it was somewhat incomplete - maybe because they adapted just the first mangas and hoped for a sequel? And speaking of samurai and good manga/anime adaptations, I'm in the middle of watching all Rurouni Kenshin live action movies. I watched the anime series and OVAs many years ago (when Netflix was still a DVD only service) and really like them, especially the origins OVA and the middle ark in the series (the first two seasons were shown on CN I believe). I'll write more once I'm done but at the moment I'm really digging it, they highlighted the best storyline and the characters actually look and act like their anime version, for a change. The cinematography and sword fights are great, of course. Why does it remind me of the prequels? Probably because, despite the frequent action, it still sets aside time for reflexion... and certain degree of melancholy? The main character (Kenshin) is a former assassin who's sworn off murder but still gets pulled into trouble by various forces which leads to constant moral conundrums. Imagine if Anakin manages to turn back to light before the battle on Mustafar... but loses Padme in the process? What would've his life been like? Same here with Alita: beautiful but incomplete. The problem is that they somehow failed to expose the world building: is not necessary to be exposed to the last detail but somehow the viewer should know what are the main threads of the social order there. Like for example, who and what are the Martians there? We see that their elite soldiers were like Alita but are all the Martians androids of some kind? And so on and so far. This is what SW Lucas Saga does in every movie and this isthe point where the sequel trilogy fails in every one of its movies as they rely mainly on what the viewer knows of the SW lore and this is not the best idea. In the Lucas Saga is not like that at all. Alita doesn't give me PT vibes no matter that the production is very interesting and beautiful, but in short the movie represents very industrialized world. There are some shots that are in the "wild" but mostly we see a city composed by machinery and naturally sterile (no real nature there). The theme of the machines vs. nature and machine vs.human is very crucial in Lucas Saga. The prequel times are times of life where we see beautiful organic landscapes, even Tattoine looks kind a less lifeless. The Empire would later industrialize (and practically destroy) all this but in PT we see the real pristine beauty of the natural landscapes of various planets. The prequels in this aspect can be defined as pastoral while the OT (for the Empire) look almost sterile, machine like type of place. |
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Post by natalie on Oct 6, 2021 1:40:07 GMT
I agree about the world building, but it beyond that, the ending just wasn't very satisfying... kind of like the Original Trilogy without ROTJ. As far as manga adaptations go, these Rurouni Kenshin movies have had more success in adapting the stories on screen with proper beginning, middle and end (granted, having watched anime series, however many years ago, might have helped, too).
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Apr 29, 2022 1:18:28 GMT
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on May 14, 2022 18:32:35 GMT
George Nolfi's The Adjustment Bureau
"Are you an angel?"
- The Phantom Menace
"Are you angels?"
- The Adjustment Bureau
This thriller is one of my favourite films of the 2010s. And there is a lot of competition in the early 2010s, let me tell you that! In its passionate blend of science-fiction and romance, it shares much in common with the Prequel Trilogy. And I don't mean any run of the mill, love interest either, I mean a romantic plot front and centre. 
Fath or one's future is a persistent theme. Are chance events really just coincidental? Can my romantic life coexist with my professional life, and if not, why not? Are we slaves to our destinies, or do we have free will? And if events are beyond my control, what can I do to change that? Should I really meddle with destiny, if there are unforeseen consequences?
Matt Damon's protagonist is very Anakin-esque as a public figure, driven by great ambition, with an even greater potential future. He's also infatuated with the woman of his dreams. Whether he will ever reconcile his public and private lives remains an open question.
If Anakin and Padmé had been born on Planet Earth, maybe it would look something like this, ha.
Commonalities
- Memorable scores, with some haunting pieces
- Mysterious, shadowy antagonist - Protagonist is a public figure, whose career is on the rise - Female lead is well rounded, with ambitions of her own
- A philosophical treatise on destiny - Supernatural abilities - Nichey, never intended to be Oscar bate
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Post by Pyrogenic on May 14, 2022 21:24:48 GMT
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on May 17, 2022 14:49:49 GMT
This definitely had some big AotC vibes going on. It's not as spectacular as a film, but like Valerian, I like the aesthetic and feel of it. I kind of said it in a different thread, but the first three Pirates films have some prequel DNA, with ILM doing a fantastic job on Davy Jones like they did on General Grievous. With both characters a lot of the acting was in their expressive eyes, which is a common thing with great villains.    (Extra example just because. I also notice that all three have inhuman looking mouth areas. Hmm.) PotC really pushed the CGI with its fantasy elements similarly to the prequels. Davy Jones still stands out as one of the finest and most realistic CGI characters to date, which for me include Gollum and also Watto, an underrated achievement. |
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Post by Pyrogenic on May 17, 2022 19:25:24 GMT
Speaking of hyper-digital, two-hours-twenty-two-minutes-long, yellow-car, ultra-romance, Owen-and-Cliegg-Lars-actor-featuring, (almost)-Leonardo DiCaprio-starring, critically-underperforming, similarly-budgeted, Australia-connected, Pyrogenic-approved-visual-effect-extravaganzas about being contemporaneous with Spider-Man-Tobey-Maguire and also being generally meta about aggressively copying Attack of the Clones...
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on May 17, 2022 20:20:50 GMT
Speaking of hyper-digital, two-hours-twenty-two-minutes-long, yellow-car, ultra-romance, Owen-and-Cliegg-Lars-actor-featuring, (almost)-Leonardo DiCaprio-starring, critically-underperforming, similarly-budgeted, Australia-connected, Pyrogenic-approved-visual-effect-extravaganzas about being contemporaneous with Spider-Man-Tobey-Maguire and also being generally meta about aggressively copying Attack of the Clones... Awesome, yes! This is exactly why this thread is so cool, getting some good recommendations. I never saw The Great Gatsby, but I remember being dazzled by the visual style just from the trailers. I really love the hyper-digital look for some reason. I'm going to have to finally watch this and rewatch Jupiter Ascending. Other more recent films that used a lot of digital effects that come to my mind are Noah (2014), which is one of my favorite films. Ham's story in the film mirrors Anakin's quite a bit: And King Arthur: Legend of the Sword, which may not be a great film, but it's a pretty entertaining ride as expected of a Guy Ritchie film. You don't see a lot of old fashioned, stand alone swashbuckling adventure films like this that aren't part of a mega-shared-franchise-universe-series in the age of Marvel:  |
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on May 18, 2022 11:44:55 GMT
Speaking of hyper-digital, two-hours-twenty-two-minutes-long, yellow-car, ultra-romance, Owen-and-Cliegg-Lars-actor-featuring, (almost)-Leonardo DiCaprio-starring, critically-underperforming, similarly-budgeted, Australia-connected, Pyrogenic-approved-visual-effect-extravaganzas about being contemporaneous with Spider-Man-Tobey-Maguire and also being generally meta about aggressively copying Attack of the Clones...
The ROTS novelisation often feels like it was written by F. Scott Fitzgerald. The late Galactic Republic very much captures the spirit of the Roaring 1920s, with all the glamour and splendour, with all the complacency and hubris, the calm before the storm.
If someone were ever to write the ROTS novelisation from the first person perspective of Ahsoka, then it'll look like The Great Gatsby in space.
The film is decent. The novel is untouchable  |
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Post by jppiper on Jun 17, 2022 23:33:32 GMT
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 18, 2022 0:50:47 GMT
There were plenty of influences on the original Star Wars, Joe.
Films arise out of cultural environnements. And just as a biosphere both distributes and receives Oxygen and Carbon Dioxide, we find that cultures are forever in a process of importing and exporting influence, deliberate and inadvertent, accumulating and filtering.
No culture is an island. The borrowing is so vast, and so complex in its forms, you might be forgiven for mistaking a creditor for a debtor. A culture appropriates other cultures, like the body appropriates water.
I may not be qualified to speak about the cultural environnement that was 1970s USA, but I do know it was responsible for quite a lot of what I love about cinema. It was a dynamic time.
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Post by smittysgelato on Jul 10, 2022 4:31:28 GMT
I do adore the fact that Qui-Gon Jinn is the second coming of none other than Bruce Lee!
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Nov 9, 2022 15:00:39 GMT
The Riddick movies, particularly the second one, were heavily influenced by Star Wars and feature that 2000s digital look. The second one, The Chronicles of Riddick, went straight up space opera, while the other two are a little different. Kind of hokey, but very endearing movies that show a spark of imagination similar to the prequels.
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Post by tonyg on Nov 9, 2022 19:50:06 GMT
I like Treasure planet a lot. For me is a great example of "updated " adaptation: in short, Treasure island in space, but it works great and it works great as children's movie. Actually, when I was little I watched similar adaptation that followed the text of the book, but was again sci fi like adaptation (live, not animated movie). A difference from King Arthur, ugh. I love the legend, but with one exception, actually I think the cinema consistently fails to show it in its splendor. I dislike the hooligan style of Guy Ritchie movies, well, except in the case when they treat indeed the London underground, but Treasure planet is elegant and splendid. However, I have never looked for such paralels with SW. |
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Nov 9, 2022 20:37:52 GMT
I like Treasure planet a lot. For me is a great example of "updated " adaptation: in short, Treasure island in space, but it works great and it works great as children's movie. Actually, when I was little I watched similar adaptation that followed the text of the book, but was again sci fi like adaptation (live, not animated movie). A difference from King Arthur, ugh. I love the legend, but with one exception, actually I think the cinema consistently fails to show it in its splendor. I dislike the hooligan style of Guy Ritchie movies, well, except in the case when they treat indeed the London underground, but Treasure planet is elegant and splendid. However, I have never looked for such paralels with SW. I have some memories of Treasure Island being read to us in kindergarten, and me being very scared by it. The book had a drawing of Long John Silver on the cover which haunted my dreams.  But I really liked Treasure Planet. It was probably my favorite Disney animated movie, and I liked a lot of them, such as Tarzan, Hercules and The Hunchback of Notre Dame. I always associated Treasure Planet with AotC, as they came out in the same year. The characters of Jim Hawkins and Anakin not only looked similar, but both were racers and dreamed of bigger things among the stars. There is a similarity in the vibrant color palettes of AotC and Treasure Planet, and the use of CGI. The goofy robot character reminded me of C-3PO and that sort of thing. King Arthur and Ritchie's films as a whole are a bit bone-headed, I agree there. But there is a kinetic kind of energy to them, in my experience, that I like quite a bit. The movie isn't a faithful adaptation or anything, but I find it entertaining in a "switch off your brain" kind of way. It works as just a fantasy film. I would be very interested to know what that other sci-fi adaptation of Treasure Island is, because I've never heard of such a thing. |
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Post by tonyg on Nov 10, 2022 0:03:33 GMT
I like Treasure planet a lot. For me is a great example of "updated " adaptation: in short, Treasure island in space, but it works great and it works great as children's movie. Actually, when I was little I watched similar adaptation that followed the text of the book, but was again sci fi like adaptation (live, not animated movie). A difference from King Arthur, ugh. I love the legend, but with one exception, actually I think the cinema consistently fails to show it in its splendor. I dislike the hooligan style of Guy Ritchie movies, well, except in the case when they treat indeed the London underground, but Treasure planet is elegant and splendid. However, I have never looked for such paralels with SW. I have some memories of Treasure Island being read to us in kindergarten, and me being very scared by it. The book had a drawing of Long John Silver on the cover which haunted my dreams. But I really liked Treasure Planet. It was probably my favorite Disney animated movie, and I liked a lot of them, such as Tarzan, Hercules and The Hunchback of Notre Dame. I always associated Treasure Planet with AotC, as they came out in the same year. The characters of Jim Hawkins and Anakin not only looked similar, but both were racers and dreamed of bigger things among the stars. There is a similarity in the vibrant color palettes of AotC and Treasure Planet, and the use of CGI. The goofy robot character reminded me of C-3PO and that sort of thing. King Arthur and Ritchie's films as a whole are a bit bone-headed, I agree there. But there is a kinetic kind of energy to them, in my experience, that I like quite a bit. The movie isn't a faithful adaptation or anything, but I find it entertaining in a "switch off your brain" kind of way. It works as just a fantasy film. I would be very interested to know what that other sci-fi adaptation of Treasure Island is, because I've never heard of such a thing. I have to research it, because I remember this adaptation vaguely. It is an old TV Italian movie if I'm not mistaken and I remember just few details, for example they used knives as weapons, only these knives were moved by thought and not by hand and it was cool. Actually, this movie made me give second chance to Treasure Island because I found it very dull when I first tried to read it. So this is the effect of the good adaptation, no matter that it is close to the book or more 'inventive' like Treasure Planet: makes you read the book. About King Arthur, the movie that best represents the legend in my opinion is actually a movie about Merlin: two part series from 1998 that has amazing quality production for a series. The story of Merlin they presented there has some similarities with the story of Anakin as Merlin is a wizard who actually doesn't do magic, but in his case is more of a choice he made because if he does what he is destined for, the world would fall. So what is to be the hero: to be all powerful or to deny to be it? These are very important questions, that's why they are asked in those movies. |
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But I really liked Treasure Planet. It was probably my favorite Disney animated movie, and I liked a lot of them, such as Tarzan, Hercules and The Hunchback of Notre Dame. I always associated Treasure Planet with AotC, as they came out in the same year. The characters of Jim Hawkins and Anakin not only looked similar, but both were racers and dreamed of bigger things among the stars. There is a similarity in the vibrant color palettes of AotC and Treasure Planet, and the use of CGI. The goofy robot character reminded me of C-3PO and that sort of thing.