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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 5, 2022 8:58:25 GMT
Yes, the blackness of Vader and Reva are worth discussing. Two very, very different discussions, worthy of its own thread, and probably beyond the scope of this thread should anyone dare give their thoughts on it. As villains, especially. Yeah, very true. Too hefty for this thread, in all honesty. Fans throwing false dichotomies around is not an encouraging sign that there will be an adult, nuanced discussion, anyway. Phasma was a bit of a token in the ST. All that talk of a female stormtrooper villain, something that's never been seen before, a good actress in the role, unique-looking armour, yadda yadda... and then the final thing fell flat on its face. Neither JJ nor RJ did right by her. I do like the idea that Vader and Reva are fifty years apart in creation (nearly), yet they fit so perfectly together. The Inquisitor makeup and costuming are also really satisfying in the series, I have to say. I get that they're a bit comic book-y in their presence and mannerisms, but hey, that's Star Wars. Ah, well caught! I kinda like the fact that they made him look a bit more "human" than his alien-looking counterpart in "Rebels". Rupert Friend is imposing and intimidating enough. He's meant to be a Pau'an, right? Maybe he's a reject/outcast. That in itself ties him in with Episode III and the "monster movie" theme. Sidious came into my mind as a point of comparison when I saw people complaining that Friend overacts. Same thing got said back in the days of ROTS for Ian McDiarmid chewing the scenery in the second half of the movie. I'm like, yeah.... and?!!! It's a great dynamic. Gave the show a real edge. The third episode is already the least of the three to me because of this not being in the mix. Sadly, the Obi-Wan/Vader thing isn't on the same level. It's not bad, but there was much better dialogue and acting between Reva and the GI. Obi-Wan's trembling fear and anticipation of encountering Anakin again is more compelling than their actual confrontation, in my opinion.
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Jun 5, 2022 12:55:51 GMT
The show getting savaged by Forbes: www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2022/06/04/somehow-obi-wan-kenobi-makes-a-showdown-with-darth-vader-boring/?sh=6b65cb141dd8It's also getting pretty brutal audience reviews on Rotten Tomatoes. This is not the reception I was expecting when the trailers came out and the press tour was going on. They had so much good will from the publicity with Ewan and Hayden, with a reignited love for the prequels from the community. I feel pretty bad for Ewan and Hayden, because it felt like they were just getting love from the fans, only for the show to get trashed. That Forbes review does echo a lot of the criticisms leveled by fans, myself included.
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Post by hernalt on Jun 5, 2022 13:50:07 GMT
Obi-Wan and the skyhopper toy reminded me of Qui-Gon saying, in a particular pitch, with a raised brow, "They have Podracing on Malastare. Very fast. Very Dangerous."
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Post by nickromancer on Jun 5, 2022 16:17:12 GMT
The show getting savaged by Forbes: www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2022/06/04/somehow-obi-wan-kenobi-makes-a-showdown-with-darth-vader-boring/?sh=6b65cb141dd8It's also getting pretty brutal audience reviews on Rotten Tomatoes. This is not the reception I was expecting when the trailers came out and the press tour was going on. They had so much good will from the publicity with Ewan and Hayden, with a reignited love for the prequels from the community. I feel pretty bad for Ewan and Hayden, because it felt like they were just getting love from the fans, only for the show to get trashed. That Forbes review does echo a lot of the criticisms leveled by fans, myself included. Disney’s Star Wars will continue to be critically panned until they can write stories that don’t rely on the Star Wars universe and characters for their attention, I think George Lucas said that you can write any movie in Star Wars, but fan authors have too limited an idea of what fits in the universe or feels like Star Wars, so they do the same old stuff
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Post by Anthony on Jun 5, 2022 16:43:26 GMT
The audience score doesn't mean much. Fandom menace or anti-fandom menace raids regularly distort it, especially since the controversy around Ingram
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 5, 2022 23:08:48 GMT
The audience score doesn't mean much. Fandom menace or anti-fandom menace raids regularly distort it, especially since the controversy around IngramCome on, he's not that bad. Ingram
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Post by Ingram on Jun 6, 2022 1:44:48 GMT
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 6, 2022 10:11:55 GMT
The show getting savaged by Forbes: www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2022/06/04/somehow-obi-wan-kenobi-makes-a-showdown-with-darth-vader-boring/?sh=6b65cb141dd8It's also getting pretty brutal audience reviews on Rotten Tomatoes. This is not the reception I was expecting when the trailers came out and the press tour was going on. They had so much good will from the publicity with Ewan and Hayden, with a reignited love for the prequels from the community. I feel pretty bad for Ewan and Hayden, because it felt like they were just getting love from the fans, only for the show to get trashed. That Forbes review does echo a lot of the criticisms leveled by fans, myself included. Here's where I am with the whole thing at the moment: I like the series. Scratch that: I really like the series. But that doesn't mean it's without its flaws. The third episode felt off to me on a first viewing, so I immediately re-watched it after sharing my initial thoughts in the thread. The second viewing improved things for me, but I still think the third episode is where the series possibly went a little awry. Not sure. What I'm planning to do today is to re-watch all three episodes from scratch. I attempted this yesterday by watching the first episode again (this was only the second time of seeing it in full again), but then I ran out of time. I'm also comparing it with "The Mandalorian". But wait, I haven't seen that series, right? Hold on, 'cos... Cryo started watching "The Mandalorian" yesterday. Yes, let me say that again: I started watching "The Mandalorian". At long last!!! Well, so far: the first four episodes. My verdict? Good, really good. Perhaps even better than Obi-Wan. What I noticed is that "The Mandalorian" -- can I just call it Mando? -- is more polished than Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan hits higher and has some exceptional stuff within it (as I was reminded by re-watching the first episode yesterday), but Mando is more consistent. At least, based on what I've seen. I think Obi-Wan deliberately varies itself more, so that's okay. But there's something to be said for rugged consistency, too. Where Obi-Wan wins big is in the human stakes and its sense of scale. Mando feels more self-contained and a little less consequential. But each episode of Mando (especially the first three which are obviously telling an introductory story in three parts) feels polished and focused with good production values. Mando also seems to have better pacing and editing than Obi-Wan. And there seems to have been a bit more care put into it by giving each episode a title and a unique end-credits sequence where all the production art is shown off. Even the cinematography is somewhat better in Mando. Obi-Wan has more scale, but there are few wasted shots in Mando, almost no shaky cam (that I recall this second?), and none of that sloppy, fringe-y artifacting around the actors' faces, where backgrounds are blurred out to save money or the compositing is a little rushed. It's hard to me conclusive about it, however, without re-watching all three available episodes of Obi-Wan in full. That said, the action choreography seems more on-point in Mando, compared to some of the unfortunate sloppiness of Obi-Wan (the awkward, slow running of little Leia, and the way the Obi-Wan/Vader confrontation was blocked and shot vs. the epic shootouts in Mando). The one aspect between the two series that I'm 50/50 on is the music. Obi-Wan might have some slightly more generic scoring in it, but it also benefits enormously from having music scored by John Williams, the master himself. His scoring hit me as very beautiful on Tatooine and in the credits, at the end on my re-watch of the first episode yesterday. Obi-Wan's theme has already grown on me and feels naturally part of the Star Wars/John Williams musical landscape. Here, Obi-Wan elevates itself above Mando and attains a more cinematic quality. It befits the fact that Obi-Wan is a major legacy character, and a Jedi, at that. But they're wringing good depth out of the whole Mandalorian/bounty hunter concept in Mando. I didn't expect to be enjoying the series as much as I am. Of course, having seen four episodes, I'm already a quarter of the way through the series as it presently stands (I understand they're making a third season and they are planning a fourth). At least I now have some sense what other fans have been talking about the past couple of years (including my sister and her partner who like the prequels and love the Filoni-Favreau series). That actually gets to me a bit: How come Obi-Wan is consigned to six episodes, but Mando himself already has sixteen episodes, and it looks like another sixteen are incoming? Why couldn't the Obi-Wan series at least match Mando's complement of eight in a season? I guess there is some cool symmetry to be made of six. Perhaps Deborah Chow, whether she pushed for six or not, is quite the Saga fangirl and is trying to make her six-episode series rhyme with the six-movie Lucas Saga. I kinda have that feeling. Still, given the fact that the Obi-Wan episodes vary in length and seem to be mirroring the Mando concept quite closely where episodes average around 35 minutes each, it feels like a bit of a scam on Disney's part. This is not the sprawling miniseries of my prequel-loving fantasies. It's Mando Lite. I don't want to sound ungrateful, though. Just getting anything like this is an insane bonus. It's just a bit disappointing to see the solid quality of Mando, where it feels like they cut corners a bit, by comparison, in Obi-Wan. I can now appreciate what you were saying about this before, Seeker of the Whills . All that said... The Obi-Wan series is more inspiring to talk about -- like the prequels. Will it, however, unlike the prequels, just become a clumsy, forgettable mess a few months (or maybe even a few weeks) from now? I hope not, but I can't dismiss the possibility. The prequels are so stacked, so layered, and so steadily executed, it's hard to see how even the best-made television series can really stand up to them. Especially something operating in similar waters. It only begs for them to be compared and for one to suffer in the comparison. Other Disney things duck away from the prequels. This series confronts the "matter-of-fact" reality of the prequels fairly head-on. As for the fandom menace: Remember, much of what is being said now (I was going through the user comments on Rotten Tomatoes) was once said about the prequels. If this series allegedly destroys Obi-Wan and makes him look stupid and pathetic, never forget that fans used to say that Anakin was a whiny punk, a moron for falling for Sidious' lies, and that Order 66 showed the Jedi dying like a bunch of pansies. How come the Jedi couldn't sense the "obvious" betrayal? Where, they cried, were scenes of Darth Vader helping the Empire hunt down and destroy the Jedi? Lucas was just a lazy hack trying to quickly make ROTS "match up" with ANH, they said. Star Wars was ruined because it was "laughable" to imagine Jar Jar Binks and Darth Vader inhabiting the same universe. And it was a "blatant plot hole and obviously terrible writing" that Leia remembered Padme where Luke could not. "Lucas only cared about selling toys", they used to say. This type of complaining is nothing new. Indeed, there would be nothing new if these fans had their way. It always goes against established canon. It's always sloppy and contrived. It's always ridiculous and unbelievable. It's always because Luca$/Di$ney only wants your money. While being reluctant to criticise can be a bad thing, negativity comes easy to this fanbase. We shouldn't be so easily swayed by a fugue of angry voices. Ultimately, truth is in the eye of the beholder.
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 6, 2022 11:01:16 GMT
You know, just to drop back in again with one thing... I think the Obi-Wan series has already deepened the following scene (I was re-watching it just now): Title: Obi-Wan and Anakin last meeting as BFF Uploader: InfoSlide Date: 4 Oct 2019 Here's the top comment: Natasha Romanov, 5 months ago "Obi-Wan. May the Force be with you" "Goodbye, old friend. May the Force be with you" The fact that Anakin wanted to be with his master but he has to obey on the task they have placed upon him and Obi-Wan is confident enough to leave him alone on this moment, believing that nothing could ever come between them, make their words so deep
I think it's worth reproducing Obi-Wan's little speech to Anakin, because it contains to much meaning and goes to the core of what she talks of above: "You are strong and wise, Anakin, and I am very proud of you. I have trained you since you were a small boy, I have taught you everything I know, and you have become a far greater Jedi than I could ever hope to be. But be patient, Anakin. It will not be long before the Council makes you a Jedi Master."Those words from Obi-Wan do, indeed, cut deep. "You have become a far greater Jedi than I could ever hope to be" now rings with added poignancy in light of the new series. Perhaps Obi-Wan, his swagger and surface confidence aside, never really did have a strong impression of himself as a Jedi. And Anakin brought all his faith and optimism, his capacity to reassure and to feel reassured, his precious sense of self, crashing down -- especially after all the fallout following their confrontation on Mustafar. One thing that really stands out about that scene is how Obi-Wan is relying on tricks and platitudes, casting spells with his words of comfort to Anakin; which Anakin interprets differently than intended. It's not that Obi-Wan is lying to him, but he is trying to assuage Anakin's fears and doubts, yet his pacifying words end up producing the opposite effect (Anakin's face at the end). No wonder Obi-Wan becomes mired in doubt and uncertainty thereafter. Who wouldn't be? Even Jedi have their limits. This series is a genuine attempt to work with the raw material of a shattered Obi-Wan and make something very human and moving about its subject matter, I think. Consider that scene again and all the brokenness Obi-Wan would feel when his pride in Anakin and his attempts to console him became his and the galaxy's undoing. It's gorgeous, it's beautiful, it's tragic -- it's Star Wars.
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 6, 2022 11:14:48 GMT
A nod to everyone asking Ewan to say Hello there:
"Father, aren't you going to say hello?" "Hello" A silly video you might enjoy! From the same episode, there's also this little gem -- sorry, I can't resist!
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Jun 6, 2022 12:01:47 GMT
The show getting savaged by Forbes: www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2022/06/04/somehow-obi-wan-kenobi-makes-a-showdown-with-darth-vader-boring/?sh=6b65cb141dd8It's also getting pretty brutal audience reviews on Rotten Tomatoes. This is not the reception I was expecting when the trailers came out and the press tour was going on. They had so much good will from the publicity with Ewan and Hayden, with a reignited love for the prequels from the community. I feel pretty bad for Ewan and Hayden, because it felt like they were just getting love from the fans, only for the show to get trashed. That Forbes review does echo a lot of the criticisms leveled by fans, myself included. Here's where I am with the whole thing at the moment: I like the series. Scratch that: I really like the series. But that doesn't mean it's without its flaws. The third episode felt off to me on a first viewing, so I immediately re-watched it after sharing my initial thoughts in the thread. The second viewing improved things for me, but I still think the third episode is where the series possibly went a little awry. Not sure. What I'm planning to do today is to re-watch all three episodes from scratch. I attempted this yesterday by watching the first episode again (this was only the second time of seeing it in full again), but then I ran out of time. I'm also comparing it with "The Mandalorian". But wait, I haven't seen that series, right? Hold on, 'cos... Cryo started watching "The Mandalorian" yesterday. Yes, let me say that again: I started watching "The Mandalorian". At long last!!! Well, so far: the first four episodes. My verdict? Good, really good. Perhaps even better than Obi-Wan. What I noticed is that "The Mandalorian" -- can I just call it Mando? -- is more polished than Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan hits higher and has some exceptional stuff within it (as I was reminded by re-watching the first episode yesterday), but Mando is more consistent. At least, based on what I've seen. I think Obi-Wan deliberately varies itself more, so that's okay. But there's something to be said for rugged consistency, too. Where Obi-Wan wins big is in the human stakes and its sense of scale. Mando feels more self-contained and a little less consequential. But each episode of Mando (especially the first three which are obviously telling an introductory story in three parts) feels polished and focused with good production values. Mando also seems to have better pacing and editing than Obi-Wan. And there seems to have been a bit more care put into it by giving each episode a title and a unique end-credits sequence where all the production art is shown off. Even the cinematography is somewhat better in Mando. Obi-Wan has more scale, but there are few wasted shots in Mando, almost no shaky cam (that I recall this second?), and none of that sloppy, fringe-y artifacting around the actors' faces, where backgrounds are blurred out to save money or the compositing is a little rushed. It's hard to me conclusive about it, however, without re-watching all three available episodes of Obi-Wan in full. That said, the action choreography seems more on-point in Mando, compared to some of the unfortunate sloppiness of Obi-Wan (the awkward, slow running of little Leia, and the way the Obi-Wan/Vader confrontation was blocked and shot vs. the epic shootouts in Mando). The one aspect between the two series that I'm 50/50 on is the music. Obi-Wan might have some slightly more generic scoring in it, but it also benefits enormously from having music scored by John Williams, the master himself. His scoring hit me as very beautiful on Tatooine and in the credits, at the end on my re-watch of the first episode yesterday. Obi-Wan's theme has already grown on me and feels naturally part of the Star Wars/John Williams musical landscape. Here, Obi-Wan elevates itself above Mando and attains a more cinematic quality. It befits the fact that Obi-Wan is a major legacy character, and a Jedi, at that. But they're wringing good depth out of the whole Mandalorian/bounty hunter concept in Mando. I didn't expect to be enjoying the series as much as I am. Of course, having seen four episodes, I'm already a quarter of the way through the series as it presently stands (I understand they're making a third season and they are planning a fourth). At least I now have some sense what other fans have been talking about the past couple of years (including my sister and her partner who like the prequels and love the Filoni-Favreau series). That actually gets to me a bit: How come Obi-Wan is consigned to six episodes, but Mando himself already has sixteen episodes, and it looks like another sixteen are incoming? Why couldn't the Obi-Wan series at least match Mando's complement of eight in a season? I guess there is some cool symmetry to be made of six. Perhaps Deborah Chow, whether she pushed for six or not, is quite the Saga fangirl and is trying to make her six-episode series rhyme with the six-movie Lucas Saga. I kinda have that feeling. Still, given the fact that the Obi-Wan episodes vary in length and seem to be mirroring the Mando concept quite closely where episodes average around 35 minutes each, it feels like a bit of a scam on Disney's part. This is not the sprawling miniseries of my prequel-loving fantasies. It's Mando Lite. I don't want to sound ungrateful, though. Just getting anything like this is an insane bonus. It's just a bit disappointing to see the solid quality of Mando, where it feels like they cut corners a bit, by comparison, in Obi-Wan. I can now appreciate what you were saying about this before, Seeker of the Whills . All that said... The Obi-Wan series is more inspiring to talk about -- like the prequels. Will it, however, unlike the prequels, just become a clumsy, forgettable mess a few months (or maybe even a few weeks) from now? I hope not, but I can't dismiss the possibility. The prequels are so stacked, so layered, and so steadily executed, it's hard to see how even the best-made television series can really stand up to them. Especially something operating in similar waters. It only begs for them to be compared and for one to suffer in the comparison. Other Disney things duck away from the prequels. This series confronts the "matter-of-fact" reality of the prequels fairly head-on. As for the fandom menace: Remember, much of what is being said now (I was going through the user comments on Rotten Tomatoes) was once said about the prequels. If this series allegedly destroys Obi-Wan and makes him look stupid and pathetic, never forget that fans used to say that Anakin was a whiny punk, a moron for falling for Sidious' lies, and that Order 66 showed the Jedi dying like a bunch of pansies. How come the Jedi couldn't sense the "obvious" betrayal? Where, they cried, were scenes of Darth Vader helping the Empire hunt down and destroy the Jedi? Lucas was just a lazy hack trying to quickly make ROTS "match up" with ANH, they said. Star Wars was ruined because it was "laughable" to imagine Jar Jar Binks and Darth Vader inhabiting the same universe. And it was a "blatant plot hole and obviously terrible writing" that Leia remembered Padme where Luke could not. "Lucas only cared about selling toys", they used to say. This type of complaining is nothing new. Indeed, there would be nothing new if these fans had their way. It always goes against established canon. It's always sloppy and contrived. It's always ridiculous and unbelievable. It's always because Luca$/Di$ney only wants your money. While being reluctant to criticise can be a bad thing, negativity comes easy to this fanbase. We shouldn't be so easily swayed by a fugue of angry voices. Ultimately, truth is in the eye of the beholder. Cryo venturing into spinoff territory? We have waited a long time for this moment. There is something about the confident way Mando is shot and directed that gives it a stronger air than Obi-Wan. Obi should feel quite similar with a lone hero escorting a child to safety, but something doesn't quite click. Like when Obi is on the road with little Leia, there isn't the same level of gravitas as when Mando is travelling with "Baby Yoda." I think with Mando they hit a good balance in consistency all across the board. Like you say, the pacing and editing is better, while Obi-Wan is more jumpy. I think nickromancer is right that Disney Star Wars should take more risks, and I think with Mando they did that (for example by having a faceless protagonist) and got it right. It seems that whenever they try to incorporate existing characters from Lucas' films, the fanbase rejects it. It may have seemed that the Filoni-Favreau team was the magic combo, but even they couldn't replicate the success of Mando with Book of Boba Fett. I think subconsciously people are recognizing that the characters don't feel the same without Lucas writing/directing. So Disney should focus on new characters, like Mando. This is why I'm partially most excited for the "Acolyte" series, because it has to feature all-new characters. Rogue One also had new characters, and it is probably the most widely beloved, or at least the least controversial Star Wars film from Disney. About the music, I think both series are good in that regard. I LOVE the Mando theme which perfectly fits and describes the series, and the cue that is repeated often never gets old. The Obi-Wan theme by John Williams is great, and I especially liked the music in the scene where Reva arrives at the Inquisitors' base. I would say Mando is a little better with the music, but neither series quite reaches the greatness of the films. I still think episode 3 was the best of Obi-Wan so far, but I definitely see the cracks appearing in the construction. I thought the episode had the strongest sequence of the three episodes, which was Obi and Leia's ride with the moleman. That sequence had some of the flair of Mando, with our heroes on the road, and had great tension. I would so far rank the episodes 3>1>2. First episode had great performances from Joe Edgerton and Jimmy Smits, and I just like their characters. Second episode had Haja, who I liked also. But the overall plot is kind of messy and there are odd parts that are confusing. Like why did Haja help Obi and Leia, and the woman who helped them in the third episode, does she always kill her stormtroopers when she helps out a Jedi? Wouldn't she have got caught by the Empire already?
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 6, 2022 13:20:11 GMT
Cryo venturing into spinoff territory? We have waited a long time for this moment. HAHA! Yes, they finally suckered me in. Yeah, the Obi-Wan series feels a tad inconsistent and slightly erratic. Mando look and feels more controlled. That said, there are some exceptionally well-done scenes and moments in the new series, and this part of the lore -- be it expanded/excessive/fake/Disney lore or whatever -- is still fascinating. You know, not to be a dick, but even the effects in Mando are a little better -- maybe? The little action sequence of Mando/Din chasing after the Jawas and climbing up the sandcrawler was extremely satisfying. For a television series, the effects work is exemplary. Even the ship landing shots are very good every time the ramp extends and Mando walks out. I now understand why this series is so acclaimed by many in the fanbase. Oh, yeah, I should have mentioned that. The faceless-protagonist thing works really well. I was very cynical about the whole bounty hunter angle of the show before watching it (I'd seen clips, however, I want to reiterate), but it is pulled off seamlessly. I've been pleasantly surprised. Excellent points. Fans are picking up on a pattern and reacting negatively to it, fairly or not. They'd be better off focusing on new characters, yes. New characters are where the vein of creativity can really be tapped. I still think there's something a tad surreal about the Obi-Wan series, though, because Ewan is back in the role. Ewan, Hayden, Jimmy, Joel, et al. Bringing these characters back is at least more palatable than scavenging the corpse of the OT in the sequels, trying to give the main three something to do and having them feel either superfluous, done badly, or focused on at the expense of the new cast. A line like "Chewie, we're home" really selfishly centers the narrative on an OT legend, while Bail reminding Obi-Wan that Leia is just as important as Luke is -- as Arch Duke pointed out -- a father arguing the worth of his daughter within this epic galaxy. In other words, one steals oxygen, the other adds to the weight of the story. On my re-watch of the first episode yesterday, I found myself enjoying the general construction and flow of it, as much -- maybe more -- than when I first watched it. I intend to write some notes about it later. I noticed on my second viewing, going in with awareness of the subsequent episodes, that it's setting a lot of stuff up, especially the theme of family. You know, a few pages back, it came up in here that maybe Reva is one of the Padawans in the opening sequence. I was only going from memory and your screenshot which shows her at a distance. But when I re-watched it yesterday, it was pretty obvious to me it must be Reva when the camera gets close. Later on, when Reva threatens Owen on Tatooine, she notes how protective he is of his family and remarks "that's important". Suddenly, you see the underlying pattern. On a first viewing, things seem a little arbitrary or posed; when you revisit, lots more details begin to strike you as deliberate and critical to the overarching narrative. In that regard, the first episode reminds me of Episode I. TPM is a preliminary movie that sets the rest of the PT (and Saga) up. Even here, it seems that Deborah Chow and writer Joby Harold took this lesson from the prequels and made their own first episode as a structural and textural mimesis of it. You know, you've got stuff going on with a beautiful planet like Alderaan, where a young ruler/monarch (or political leader to-be) is threatened/abducted, meanwhile there are Jedi in hiding being hunted by the Sith on Tatooine. And as in Episode I, the pacing on Tatooine is a bit stately and lethargic, allowing you to settle into the storytelling gradually and lending the impression of bigger things to come. Just like TPM, I've already noticed a tendency for fans to dismiss the first episode as trivial, irrelevant, tedious, boring. "Why not start with Obi-Wan agreeing to go on a rescue mission and walking straight up to the ship with his saber at his side?" (these were practically the same words of Ingram earlier). Well, yeah, they could have done that, but then the whole series would have been gutted of all the little themes and impressions they clearly used the first episode to establish. I'm just worried it's going to feel like they put more thought and care into the first episode than the others. You rank the first episode last. I would presently rank it first. While the series definitely heats up in two and three, I like the steady pacing of the first, the beautiful Obi-Wan theme, the tragicomic scenes of Obi-Wan cutting meat (marked by the blowing of a train whistle noise each time), Obi-Wan's little cave dwellings (I actually like the set design here), the scenes with the Inquisitors, Obi-Wan's reluctance to draw any attention to himself or do anything to help anyone, and then his giving into Bail, digging up the sabers, and heeding the Call To Adventure once more. It's atmospheric, gripping stuff. Not filler. Not to me, anyway. So far, the first episode feels the most movie-like of the three. I hate clutter and rushing. Energetic storytelling, yes. But not poorly-controlled freneticism. Still, there is about as much intelligence in this series, so far, that I could have hoped for. I can't answer your specific questions yet. I agree that some parts, based on my limited viewings of those episodes, seem rushed or not particularly well-explained. However, a re-watch or two might clear some of those issues up. What I fear is that they've bitten off more than they can chew and that they just decided to patch certain plot developments in without really working through the intricacies. It's not like we haven't seen this before from Disney. Some of the things the series is already getting it in the neck for might be harder to wave off as mere fan complaining. But then again, as I've said before, a lot of fans are too readily prepared to choose the Dark Side over the light. If it doesn't fit their tastes or seems stupid, then it must be stupid, end of discussion. Going in attack mode is easy. Anybody can be a two-bit critic on the Internet. It often pays to work through things a little bit and having a slightly more patient and accepting frame of mind. It's kinda crazy that this series even exists at all. I'm going to let that positive bewilderment be my compass for the time being.
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Jun 6, 2022 15:14:42 GMT
Cryo venturing into spinoff territory? We have waited a long time for this moment. HAHA! Yes, they finally suckered me in. Yeah, the Obi-Wan series feels a tad inconsistent and slightly erratic. Mando look and feels more controlled. That said, there are some exceptionally well-done scenes and moments in the new series, and this part of the lore -- be it expanded/excessive/fake/Disney lore or whatever -- is still fascinating. You know, not to be a dick, but even the effects in Mando are a little better -- maybe? The little action sequence of Mando/Din chasing after the Jawas and climbing up the sandcrawler was extremely satisfying. For a television series, the effects work is exemplary. Even the ship landing shots are very good every time the ramp extends and Mando walks out. I now understand why this series is so acclaimed by many in the fanbase. Oh, yeah, I should have mentioned that. The faceless-protagonist thing works really well. I was very cynical about the whole bounty hunter angle of the show before watching it (I'd seen clips, however, I want to reiterate), but it is pulled off seamlessly. I've been pleasantly surprised. Excellent points. Fans are picking up on a pattern and reacting negatively to it, fairly or not. They'd be better off focusing on new characters, yes. New characters are where the vein of creativity can really be tapped. I still think there's something a tad surreal about the Obi-Wan series, though, because Ewan is back in the role. Ewan, Hayden, Jimmy, Joel, et al. Bringing these characters back is at least more palatable than scavenging the corpse of the OT in the sequels, trying to give the main three something to do and having them feel either superfluous, done badly, or focused on at the expense of the new cast. A line like "Chewie, we're home" really selfishly centers the narrative on an OT legend, while Bail reminding Obi-Wan that Leia is just as important as Luke is -- as Arch Duke pointed out -- a father arguing the worth of his daughter within this epic galaxy. In other words, one steals oxygen, the other adds to the weight of the story. On my re-watch of the first episode yesterday, I found myself enjoying the general construction and flow of it, as much -- maybe more -- than when I first watched it. I intend to write some notes about it later. I noticed on my second viewing, going in with awareness of the subsequent episodes, that it's setting a lot of stuff up, especially the theme of family. You know, a few pages back, it came up in here that maybe Reva is one of the Padawans in the opening sequence. I was only going from memory and your screenshot which shows her at a distance. But when I re-watched it yesterday, it was pretty obvious to me it must be Reva when the camera gets close. Later on, when Reva threatens Owen on Tatooine, she notes how protective he is of his family and remarks "that's important". Suddenly, you see the underlying pattern. On a first viewing, things seem a little arbitrary or posed; when you revisit, lots more details begin to strike you as deliberate and critical to the overarching narrative. In that regard, the first episode reminds me of Episode I. TPM is a preliminary movie that sets the rest of the PT (and Saga) up. Even here, it seems that Deborah Chow and writer Joby Harold took this lesson from the prequels and made their own first episode as a structural and textural mimesis of it. You know, you've got stuff going on with a beautiful planet like Alderaan, where a young ruler/monarch (or political leader to-be) is threatened/abducted, meanwhile there are Jedi in hiding being hunted by the Sith on Tatooine. And as in Episode I, the pacing on Tatooine is a bit stately and lethargic, allowing you to settle into the storytelling gradually and lending the impression of bigger things to come. Just like TPM, I've already noticed a tendency for fans to dismiss the first episode as trivial, irrelevant, tedious, boring. "Why not start with Obi-Wan agreeing to go on a rescue mission and walking straight up to the ship with his saber at his side?" (these were practically the same words of Ingram earlier). Well, yeah, they could have done that, but then the whole series would have been gutted of all the little themes and impressions they clearly used the first episode to establish. I'm just worried it's going to feel like they put more thought and care into the first episode than the others. You rank the first episode last. I would presently rank it first. While the series definitely heats up in two and three, I like the steady pacing of the first, the beautiful Obi-Wan theme, the tragicomic scenes of Obi-Wan cutting meat (marked by the blowing of a train whistle noise each time), Obi-Wan's little cave dwellings (I actually like the set design here), the scenes with the Inquisitors, Obi-Wan's reluctance to draw any attention to himself or do anything to help anyone, and then his giving into Bail, digging up the sabers, and heeding the Call To Adventure once more. It's atmospheric, gripping stuff. Not filler. Not to me, anyway. So far, the first episode feels the most movie-like of the three. I hate clutter and rushing. Energetic storytelling, yes. But not poorly-controlled freneticism. Still, there is about as much intelligence in this series, so far, that I could have hoped for. I can't answer your specific questions yet. I agree that some parts, based on my limited viewings of those episodes, seem rushed or not particularly well-explained. However, a re-watch or two might clear some of those issues up. What I fear is that they've bitten off more than they can chew and that they just decided to patch certain plot developments in without really working through the intricacies. It's not like we haven't seen this before from Disney. Some of the things the series is already getting it in the neck for might be harder to wave off as mere fan complaining. But then again, as I've said before, a lot of fans are too readily prepared to choose the Dark Side over the light. If it doesn't fit their tastes or seems stupid, then it must be stupid, end of discussion. Going in attack mode is easy. Anybody can be a two-bit critic on the Internet. It often pays to work through things a little bit and having a slightly more patient and accepting frame of mind. It's kinda crazy that this series even exists at all. I'm going to let that positive bewilderment be my compass for the time being. I rewatched episode three, and it definitely felt a lot better this go around. I think a part of the disappointment in the series is unrealistically high expectations, vs. the relative surprise that was a show about a random Mandalorian. People didn't have those expectations going into it and they were surprised by such a low key, stripped back to basics approach. There are definitely highlights in Obi-Wan. Owen and Bail, Obi's nightmare, him digging up the lightsabers, finding out that Anakin is alive, all of Vader was pretty well done, Obi's hallucination of Anakin, etc. It's just that, so far, the very best thing about the series is the recap of the prequels. Yeah, the effects in Mando are groundbreaking for a TV show, it surprised me too. They almost look as good as something like Rogue One. The sandcrawler scene was incredible. That Forbes article touched on it, but Obi-Wan has so far lacked truly exciting sequences, where effects could even shine. Instead we got a slow chase where bounty hunters couldn't catch a 10 year old kid. I want something like that sandcrawler scene, the podrace or the desert chase from TRoS. Something fast and intense. Bounty hunters are't my favorite aspect of Star Wars either, but how the world is realized in Mando is so captivating that you are instantly absorbed into it. And the world feels complex and alive with different sorts of characters. It's pretty close to a Lucas-like vision. There is definitely something surreal about Ewan and Hayden and the others being back in their prequel roles, I touched on that in Reply #270. However, the fact that Obi-Wan is such a changed character dampens it a little. Many fans probably expected a more optimistic and simply fun Obi-Wan, like in the prequels. The press tour with Ewan and Hayden having fun felt even more surreal than the series itsef. But I think there is worth in the characters being further explored in this series, unlike the largely wasted OT heroes in the ST. Yeah, Reva must be the padawan at the beginning. She gets angry when she sees the Jedi Order symbol in the hideout in episode three, which I found compelling. It will be interesting to see what they do with the character. I actually rank the first episode second. But I get your point. I'm sure the first episode will feel a lot more meaningful when all episodes are out. I think it is the second episode that is the weakest and shows the limitations of this series. I kind of liked the Blade Runner 2049-esque location, but it looked too small and they were clearly running around the same set. The drug lab or whatever looked almost completely off for Star Wars, to me at least. And another chase with Leia felt pointless. I still liked it well enough, mostly thanks to Haja.
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 6, 2022 20:34:36 GMT
Okay, so a few notes on my third viewing of the first episode:
- Love the prequel montage at the start. Just a great lead-in to the series. It ends with wonderful emphasis on Yoda promising to teach Obi-Wan to commune with Qui-Gon. So far, we've seen this promise alluded to in every episode with Obi-Wan making some attempt to summon Qui-Gon and seek his guidance.
- I love the Order 66 "recap" at the beginning. Already, the series is placing a heavy emphasis on the prequel era and its tragic conclusion, and we haven't even seen the first scene yet. How awesome.
- The Younglings' tai-chi style movements, I noticed, are later echoed by young Luke's hand/arm movements when he's sat atop the entrance to the igloo of the homestead. Kind of an interesting resonance. Luke is blissfully ignorant of his heritage, just like the Younglings appear blissfully ignorant that the Jedi Temple is being stormed by clone troopers. In both cases, their ignorance is suddenly shattered and their guardians are (or will be) slaughtered by violent incursions made by the Sith Empire. There's definitely a dream-like quality to this scene as it smoothly yet incongruously transitions from peaceful training practice to brutal violence.
- I'm pretty convinced that that dark-skinned Padawan is meant to be Reva. The telling thing is that that group of Padawan Learners just runs off into the distance. We don't see any of them getting gunned down. Reva's behaviour in the rest of the series, or the three episodes we presently have, especially on Tatooine, suggests she was left abandoned and had to fend for herself after the Jedi Purge, and that she holds the Jedi responsible for failing to protect themselves from annihilation.
- The series logo is very elegant. The animation is perfect. While very minimal, the opening title seems like it fits perfectly in this modern streaming era. No messing around, we're told that this is Obi-Wan Kenobi and then we're dropped straight into the episode.
- The first shot of the show is a wide vista of Tatooine with the subtitle "TEN YEARS LATER". That works. Same time-gap as exists between TPM and AOTC. Also, there's a very strange, chalky look to Tatooine here. I don't know whether it made production a bit easier to show it this way, but it's odd. Not bad, but odd. It looks like a mist is hanging in the air in virtually every scene there. The remnants of a sandstorm, perhaps? Not sure if this is visually significant in any way.
- The Inquisitors certainly know how to make an appearance. The Grand Inquisitor monologuing in the tavern is captivating and very moody and threatening. He definitely is a lot like Darth Sidious meets Agent Smith. Love his allusion to the twin suns when intimidating the bartender. Possibly some symbolism in the fact that the Jedi runs away and pulls down a piece of the awning. The GI talks about the bartender offering the Jedi "shade from the suns" and the Jedi provides a bit of shade as he disappears. Some wonderful lighting in this scene as the GI theatrically walks around. Some shots look a little hazy, but it adds to the mystical, slightly undefinable quality of the series. Reva's impatience with the GI's routine of scaring the lower lifeforms makes for a great show opener, and the GI stopping Reva from slicing the poor Jedi's arm off with the Force is super cool.
- "Consider him forgotten." That's a really nice line to transition to Obi-Wan in the next scene, along with the dissolve to the Tatooine suns. The series is already very cinematic in many of its gestures, despite being a TV show. Also, in Star Wars, things never stay forgotten. Nice tease.
- Interesting visual of that fish carcass in the desert. "There's always a bigger fish." But this raises a question (or a couple): What line of work is Obi-Wan in and how did he get this employment? I didn't get it on a first viewing. That fish carcass is not a mere sculpture. They appear to be extracting meat from right inside it. Obviously, that wouldn't last long, so what happens then? Are there a big bunch of these carcasses strewn around and they move to each one in-turn? Also: What the heck is a giant fish doing in the desert? Maybe a "prequel" to this series is Obi-Wan bouncing from job to job and seeing his life struggles along the way. I kid, I kid. But only slightly. I'm already wanting to delve into the concept art for this show.
- Great use of a gonk droid.
- That whistle!
- Obi-Wan lingers behind and cuts off that bit of meat and pockets it. Wouldn't this be noticed by the boss/supervisor from a few feet away? He takes his time and doesn't do anything to appear inconspicuous.
- Obi-Wan's overalls are blue and green. Just thought I'd point that out.
- The little metal rollers, as well, are vaguely coloured blue and red with fish guts.
- When Obi-Wan goes to protect that employee but then thinks better of it, we see how far Obi-Wan has fallen. But the more notable thing, in terms of an underlying theme, is that the employee protests he has a family to feed and is socked in the gut before he can finish the word. I don't know how meta that is, but the family theme is already strong in the series. We see Obi-Wan in the prequel montage crying that Anakin was his brother, we see the Jedi "family" in the Jedi Temple, and then, when the Inquisitors show up, we have Reva being addressed as "Third Sister". Looks like Reva found a new family and Obi-Wan is searching to reforge some family connections. He is, of course, effectively Luke and Leia's "uncle" and he takes on a paternal role to the both of them (as this series now establishes).
- Obi-Wan wants to say something to that bully of a supervisor, but he thinks better of it. Just like he wants to still "Jedi", but keeps suppressing the urge.
- Obi-Wan being kind to his eopie. I dig it.
- Obi-Wan in a shawl. Very Qui-Gon-ish.
- Obi-Wan riding his eopie back to his cave dwellings in the desert. God, this is more Star Wars than Star Wars. And to the fabulous new Obi-Wan theme from John Williams. I love this.
- CG has really come a long way. Obi-Wan getting down off the eopie looks pretty convincing.
- Obi-Wan's little droid security system is neat. What's he so afraid of? Note the light is blue indicating no breach. It later changes to red when Bail is waiting for him inside. "Blue, it's the boy. Red, his mother." Obi-Wan is besotted with the idea of protecting Luke. Bail arrives to say, "Snap out of it, you dork. I need you to save my daughter."
- I love Obi-Wan's cave dwellings with the lantern hanging on one side and a little prayer mat (?) in the middle. He's even got a hook for his bag. It makes sense he's not living in pitch darkness, but that there's light streaming through the ceiling and more than one egress point. Surely also some symbolism in that. Anyway, his dwellings are really a mixture of a cave and a fissure.
- That broth looks good. Honestly, Obi-Wan's little stove, the skillet he's eating from, and the food itself all make more sense than Rey's magically-rising bagel in TFA. And who the heck would seriously want to live in the belly of an AT-AT? And what's a big, expensive Imperial machine doing like that in the middle of the... Ah, fuggetaboutit. I'm not meant to be slamming the sequels here. Still, the TFA scenes with Rey really came to mind when watching this part of Obi-Wan. This just seems better done.
- Obi-Wan eating while Teeka, one of his few friends/associates, comes up behind him (I guess Teeka, being a Jawa, wouldn't automatically trip the alarm). Study the image. It's one of those compositions that screams why this series was made. I don't care if the background beyond Obi-Wan looks a bit fake, the romance of the whole image sells the whole premise. Motherfucking Star Wars, y'all.
- "I could smell you from Anchorhead." I didn't know I needed wisecracking Jawas insulting old Jedi Masters, but now I do.
- That's right, Obi-Wan. Put your skillet on the side, resting against that little excavation in the rock. Perfect place for it. This series actually has its characters interacting with bits of their environment in subtle, satisfying ways. Unlike the Sequel Tri... Sorry, there I go again.
- "You're late." OMG! It's Obi-Wan. He actually talks. It's Ewan-freakin'-McGregor talking as Obi-Wan-freakin'-Kenobi. MOTHERFUCKING STAR WARS, YA'LL.
- It's a good first line from Obi-Wan. Fun fact: Those are also the first spoken words by Frodo to Gandalf in LOTR. Both Obi-Wan and Frodo are about to leave the security of home and go off on a big adventure. Maybe it's a little weird to yank Obi-Wan away from Tatooine, but if you accept the conceit, the series is evidently starting slow and building big.
- Nice humour and interaction in this first scene of Obi-Wan talking with his pal Teeka. Typical Jawa antics and a nice way to introduce the T-16 skyhopper. Ewan's acting is already perfect. Even the precious, careful way he handles the things given to him by Teeka is so Obi-Wan.
- "I've got a tribe to feed." Another riff on the family theme. Notice that Obi-Wan is now being a bit of a bastard to someone. Although Teeka is trying to gouge him for money, of course. Amusing dynamic of Obi-Wan already being wise to Teeka's ways, but not being able to do too much about it. The crafty, salty nature of the Jawas is nicely continued here from "The Mandalorian" when they steal all of Mando's valuable ship parts and refuse to give them back, unless he barters hard or completes a task for them. Those Jawas will steal the false teeth from your grandmother if given half a chance.
- Obi-Wan asking that, if Teeka has the cheek to steal his parts and sell them back to him, could he at least clean them as a courtesy? I sense a lot of prequel Obi-Wan in this moment. Echoes of his sardonic dealings with Jar Jar, Artoo, and Anakin.
- That close-up on Obi-Wan when Teeka hands him the belt and says they stripped a Jedi's ship out in the desert. And Ewan's line reading: "A Jedi?" The little glow in his eyes. This is the much-welcome return to the mystical, lost-and-found side of Star Wars I was hoping for.
- The crafty little smile when Obi-Wan says, "I've heard the Jedi are all but extinct." And the music playing. I'll stop saying this in a minute before it gets old, but MOTHERFUCKING STAR WARS, Y'ALL!!!
- Obi-Wan sarcastically thanking Teeka after he insults him again before leaving. I can't believe people can't detect the old Obi-Wan just under the surface of this ponderous, sad Obi-Wan. He's still the same good, gracious person. Just changed by his circumstances. This whole scene made me happy to be watching Ewan as Obi-Wan again.
- Obi-Wan's nightmare. This scene is really well done. It's almost all about the nightmare. Our second prequel montage in a little more than ten minutes. But hey, it works. It has a very overwhelming quality compared to the more prosaic intro. Obi-Wan coming to and looking horrified is genuinely moving. Then he beseeches Qui-Gon in the dark and we realise how lost and lonely Obi-Wan really is. Beautiful.
- For those thinking all this early stuff is wasteful and totally unnecessary, note that the gears of the plot are working concisely. It is Teeka's visit that triggers the nightmare. When Obi-Wan touches the belt, he obviously gets a flashback. It's like the scene of Rey uncovering Anakin's lightsaber in Maz's tavern. Except, it's more of an internal thing for Obi-Wan, and he has own nightmare sequence that very night.
- Seeing that little rat creature is interesting. Digging against the hardened sand with Obi-Wan riding his steed way in the background. This kind of tone poem-y, environmental stuff is something the Lucas and Disney eras have in common. Yes, the first episode takes its time, but that's to be appreciated, in my opinion. All the little moments fuse together and create something mildly Biblical and epic in its syntax and feeling.
- The Obi-Wan theme is playing again and it's just lovely every time. A really great theme that makes Star Wars feel even more complete. We are so lucky to have come this far and still have something new from John Williams. A Star Wars fan is missing out not to embrace this special moment in time. It's going to hurt when Johnny passes into the Force.
- Ewan is spending a bit of time here sitting on rocks, but I love it. The binocular's visual display is just about perfect, although some people may miss the analogue video distortion effects in the OT. Owen shouting "Luke!" is wonderful and might be the most eerily OT-like-thing in the whole series (so far). It sounds just like Owen Lars!!! Joel Edgerton really is tremendous in this.
- Owen's worrying over Luke's whereabouts, when he's really only a few feet from him, neatly establishes his protective attitude to Luke and the dangers of Tatooine itself. We then hear some other dialogue but it's practically inaudible. Obi-Wan is a bit of an eavesdropper. I wonder how often he does this? Ewan's expressions are again wonderful here. Interesting how Obi-Wan's expression drops down at the very end. What's he thinking? That he might never train Luke? That the mere thought of him becoming another Anakin brings Obi-Wan to the brink of total resignation?
- Another interesting feature of this short but important scene is how fleetingly Beru is shown. She's there for all of three seconds and then Obi-Wan zooms in on the binoculars past her to Luke and we don't see her again.
- It's odd how Luke has fairly dark hair in this scene.
- This scene isn't idly thrown in, either. It comes after Teeka hands Obi-Wan the skyhopper toy and Obi-Wan's ensuing nightmare. It's like he's looking for some reassurance before he drops the toy off at night. Of course, it's also a reminder to the audience that Obi-Wan is tasked with watching over Luke and has high hopes for him.
- The homestead at night. Always has had such a romantic quality to it. Obi-Wan dropping off the skyhopper, all cleaned up, is a nice if sly gesture on his part, as Owen later calls him out on. There is some irony in the fact that Yoda chastises Luke for craving adventure and excitement, but Luke's journey in the Force begins with a Jedi dropping him off a toy spacecraft to spur his imagination.
- Obi-Wan is located, pleaded with, and accosted by a former Jedi. The Jedi from earlier who ran off from the Inquisitors. I'm not sure how I feel about this scene. First off, it's kinda contrived that another Jedi could locate Obi-Wan on Tatooine, never mind the exact part of Tatooine he's living on. Then there's the cinematography: hello, shaky cam. There hasn't been any shaky camera work till now. None. Now (in this scene) it's every shot. And in some shots, it's really bad. I'm not sure what the motivation is for the camera to behave this way or why the steady grammar thus far is violated. Although the other Jedi is panicked, which could provide a reason, Obi-Wan is also in the scene and he's a calmer presence. The screen constantly shaking and jerking around just feels unnecessary. Perhaps it is meant to convey the unsteadiness in the Force that Obi-Wan might suddenly feel. It could be an allusion to his fight with Vader in the third episode, which also has some pretty shaky and undisciplined camera work, in a similarly dark and gloomy setting.
- Obi-Wan's initial responses to the guy are cold and sound like he's attempting a Jedi Mind Trick: "You're making some kind of mistake. You're looking for somebody else." When the guy continues to plead with him, we see Obi-Wan's underlying compassion emerge, although he continues to think more of himself by accusing the guy of drawing attention. "Stay hidden. Live a normal life." And then the advice that gets the poor guy killed: "Go back to the town. Let it go." Interestingly, the next shot is of water in bright sunlight.
- Alderaan! And how magnificent it looks here. The episode dramatically changes register and we get the "Disney Princess" side of the story. One could scarcely ask for a better contrast that helps deepen and intensify Obi-Wan's languid days on Tatooine that are about to end. Here we get a fun introduction for Leia, and Bail and Breha are just wonderful, as is child actress Vivien Lyra Blair. The "fake" Leia somewhat recalls Padme and her use of decoys in the prequels. Breha looks perfect in her costume. The music in this part is also good, even though it's not from John Williams. Of course, nothing can equal John Williams himself, but I appreciate the injection of something lively.
- Leia looks like a little Rebel pilot as she runs off and prefers to be by herself. Leia climbs her safe tree (which appears to be dotted with orange-yellow lichen). This is the same tree she runs to when she gets abducted. The LOLA droid seems to have been inspired by ladybirds. I guess Leia and Obi-Wan are both dreamers, but in quite different ways. Obi-Wan was just spying on Luke and his farm life, while Leia watches the ships and dreams of adventure. There seem to be a lot of ships taking off and leaving in a short space of time. The way Leia talks to her droid and says, "No?!" is cute. "Leia Organa!" I guess we had to have that.
- "If you behaved as well as you climb, you'd be a senator already." Two AOTC resonances. Obi-Wan berating Anakin: "If you spent as much time practicing your saber technique as you do your wit, you would rival Master Yoda as a swordsman." And Padme climbing her post in the arena on Geonosis. Also, Leia mock-apologising to her mother mirrors Anakin's sarcastic apology to Obi-Wan in the speeder: "I'm deeply sorry, Master."
- GORREEEERRRRGHHHHHH!!!! Back to Tatooine. I love that ridiculous sound. I think the sound and use of the whistle are very clever. Not merely funny, but they seem to mark something about Obi-Wan's depression and his choosing to ignore the pleas of others for help. It's a terrific stylistic device. Bit different for Star Wars, but totally feels right. Our second "day" at the fish factory and our second right back into town with Obi-Wan. He looks more vacant and depressed this time around. Great visual effects on the transport passing by.
- "It's a lot more than that." GODDAMN, Joel Edgerton is perfect in this role. So good it hurts. This whole scene, while short, is brilliantly done between Owen and Obi-Wan. Does anyone still wanna bitch that Star Wars has bad acting? Wait, they probably do.
- How good is the hair, makeup, and costuming in this show??? Hoooooo, boy. This is the most satisfying Star Wars thing I've ever watched. Well, since the prequels, I would say. Disney can sure knock some stuff out the park. The money is all there.
- "Anakin is dead, Ben." That hurts. Obi-Wan's reaction is just so full of guilt and sorrow. Also, I guess that's about as compassionate and sympathetic as Owen gets.
- The arrival of the Inquisitors is bordering on camp, yet just about maintains this sense of dread. It's like a cloud suddenly drifts over everything. Owen ironically stands in the light of the square ready to face these outlanders, while "Ben" hides away in the stable. How the mighty hath fallen.
- "You'll be rewarded well." - "Or you'll be punished." - "Reva!!!" - Yeah, I just love this pair.
- Moses Ingram totally owns this scene. She's cold, calculating, unhinged, wild, impatient... almost all at once. A very alarming and awesome character. There always has to be some mouthy idiot, doesn't there? Mouth off, lose a hand. The Brother looks annoyed. Reva is again going too far. Her boredom with Tatooine, however, seems to heighten her frustration, and is something shared with Luke in ANH: "If there's a bright center to the universe, you're on the planet that's farthest from."
- Does she sense something with Owen? She practically goes right to him. It might be a stretch if she senses Luke, but I can believe she is picking up vague traces of Owen's connection to Obi-Wan. He is probably radiating something in the Force. They were just arguing, after all.
- "You got a Jedi on that farm, too?" Damn, what a sassy line reading. She says that without blinking and it's quite awesome. And it's true. He does have a Jedi on his farm. A future Jedi Master, in fact. She's so obsessed with Obi-Wan, she misses the better prize: Luke Skywalker! Better luck next time, Reva! Owen, you just outwitted and narrowly kept your head against an Inquisitor. This surely makes Owen worthy of some serious respect.
- "You... are too impulsive." I love this little scene between Reva and The Fifth Brother. The cinematography is outstanding and, apart from a brief reaction shot at the end from Reva, it's all one take. The haze of sand that hangs floating in the background adds to the brooding nature of the scene and The Fifth Brother's strong warning for Reva to not go too far in her obsession with Kenobi. Also, the way they punch-push each other is cool, and it feels like there is a really solid quality to those costumes and the way they hold their bodies.
- Obi-Wan thanking Owen. Ewan is just pitch-perfect all the time. And, of course, Owen's rebuke: He didn't do it for Ben, but... wait for it (implied)... his family.
- Oh, man. Bail and Leia's relationship is perfectly conveyed from their first words to each other. I love, love, love this. DAMN IT!!! Jimmy Smits is absolutely perfect in the role of Bail. I'm so glad we got to see this man again. Bail and Breha deserved to be portrayed raising their daughter on the lovely world of Alderaan before it is callously destroyed by the Empire.
- "Don't encourage her." - (said immediately) "Alright." - HAHA! Bail and Breha are perfect together. What a family.
- "Come now. Let's... get this over with." Yeah, Bail doesn't like these stuck-up, asshole relations, either. I love his little seething look when that family members mocks his "bleeding heart" social/political concerns in the next scene. Really highlights what a good man Bail is. He didn't need to stick his neck out for people in need, but he always did. Unfortunately, it results in the destruction of his home world.
- The air taxi is nice. I like the landing platform, too. There's a strong prequel vibe here. Some of the visual effects, while decent, fall a bit short of the prequels. Not a biggie, though.
- "I didn't come here to end slavery, Bail." Oh, come on, I have to do it: "I didn't actually come here to free slaves." This thing is laden with prequel references, make no mistake about it.
- Leia's psychoanalysis of her cousin is perfect. He looks like a young Kylo Ren. A total narcissist in training. I'm surprised the scene didn't erupt in violence. Leia totally slays him. Bail watching with amusement really adds to their father-daughter dynamic.
- The colours in this scene are really lovely. This was exactly the sort of beauty and refinement totally missing from the sequels. Sorry, I promised not to mention them again in this set of notes, didn't I?
- There's also a neat allusion in the scene of Leia rebuking her cousin to Leia being hidden from the galaxy. The cousin mentions Leia's parents not allowing Leia to leave the planet. He condescends to her and says it's because they don't want anyone knowing she's not a "real" Organa. That's true, from a certain point of view. The real reason, of course, is they are nervous of her true lineage being uncovered. Ironically, she is about to be kidnapped.
- "He's rude to droids!" Have I established how much I adore this version of Leia? They've done a fantastic job with her character in this series so far. Leia herself could be stuck-up and rude in the OT, but she's got a good heart and strong values underneath. And these scenes on Alderaan make clear she was lucky to be adopted by Bail and Breha. Her traits and attitudes derive as much from her adoptive parents as her genetic ones.
- Bail's little hand gesture to his wife when Leia says she'd "rather be digested by a jakobeast" than apologise to her cousin. Of course, in the OT, Leia says she'd "just as soon kiss a Wookiee" than admit any feelings for Han.
- Bail's little speech to Leia as they look out at the mountains. Really heartwarming. This series totally aces their relationship. Jimmy Smits for President.
- "Don't ever say that." Bail's tone changes dramatically there and I absolutely love it. This whole scene is totally brilliant.
- "But for now... we will... apologise." Acting, acting, acting. Fucking acting. I wanna be an actor. Dammit, Jimmy Smits.
- Didn't think I needed to see a finger-handshake in Star Wars, but there it is and it's perfect.
- Bail and Alderaan, Alderaan and Bail. Sorry, but am I dreaming? Is this happening? Is this actually happening? It could be a dream, right?
- Leia dropping her outer garment to the ground. Kinda like a Jedi shedding their robes in the PT.
- "Why are you here?" That's exactly what Yoda says to Luke on Dagobah. It's like Leia has an out-of-body experience when she sees Flea against the tree. Flea against the tree. Heh, poetry. She isn't initially afraid. It's almost like she's drawn to his bright clothing. He's resting serenely on the trunk and it throws her. He can't be bad, can he? This whole scene is also a bit reminiscent of the clones suddenly showing up in the Jedi Temple in the opening scene.
- Then Leia suddenly realises it's bad and she needs to run. While the running scene has already been mocked on YouTube and I can see its sluggish, awkward qualities, I'm fine with it. It's got a hint of goof, yet it's also nightmareish. Leia went to that tree for escape and protection and now her pristine forest retreat has been violated. The trees seem be helping her a bit when she runs away. The enemies comically run into branches and fall over the uneven ground. A guard even shows up. But it's all useless. The villains seem to be taking their time. Perhaps they want to leave a trail. More than likely, they are just ridiculously incompetent. Leia managing to make them work at capturing her at least hints that there's more to her than meets the eye. The idiots never really realise who it is they're actually capturing. The whole segment also seems to be told from Leia's point of view. Again, there's a horror to it, as the roughness of the world suddenly becomes real. A little princess leaves the sanctuary of her castle one too many times and there is a consequence. Makes sense.
- Alderaan's security is a bit questionable, especially given the fact that Queen Breha's extended family has flown in. Is this how the villains actually snuck in? Were there catering vessels and the like about and they exploited the chaos/confusion to breach security? Leia watches a lot of ships taking off. But that should surely mandate pretty strict security protocols. On the other hand, the security on Alderaan looks fairly ceremonial. The Grand Inquisitor berates Reva in the second episode for kidnapping a senator's child. That's obviously considered a big no-no in the world of the Empire. The Senate still exists. You don't go stealing politicians' kids. Still, it's a little bit convenient, and the sluggish chase doesn't necessarily help matters on this front. I overlook it because Alderaan has an enhanced fantasy feel, however. It's pretty idyllic and interlopers always exist. For Bail and Breha, this is obviously a parent's worst nightmare coming true.
- Obi-Wan hearing the call for help -- and rejecting it. Poor Obi-Wan. He's in a very dark place. But before I proceed...
- Obi-Wan's box of prequel artefacts. Obi-Wan's communicator is the holographic projector Qui-Gon used in Watto's shop. The display pad looks similar to the one Anakin had in his hand in Padme's apartment, after he has a vision of Obi-Wan helping Padme in ROTS ("Obi-Wan's been here, hasn't he?"). The little satchel could be either Obi-Wan's or Qui-Gon's. Love all the beads of dust floating around when Obi-Wan opens the box. And the look on his face. It suggests he set it up the device so Bail alone could contact him in a dire emergency on a hidden frequency. It's otherwise a slight stretch to imagine Bail ever talking to Obi-Wan directly. They could both blow their cover.
- The desperation in the body language of Bail and Breha is heartbreaking. Their plea to Obi-Wan is so raw and insistent.
- "It's been ten years." The soft way Ewan says that.
- "I... I'm not who I used to be." That's what Obi-Wan was straining to avoid saying. There it is. A naked admission of weakness, resignation, hopelessness. In front of "old friends", no less. The cinematography here is again excellent. Ewan's face! It's like a painting.
- Breha's reaction just kills me here. I've never had such an emotional response to a holographic message in Star Wars before. John Williams' masterful theme adds the right touch of melancholy. I almost can't make it through this part. Bail and Breha are such excellent people; and deep inside, I imagine that Obi-Wan feels awful for letting them down.
- GAWWGGGERRRRRRRGGGGGH. Okay, we're back to the comical gonk droid whistle again. And not a moment too soon. That was an intense scene and I need a breather. Oh, Obi-Wan taking a ride back into town for the third, looking dejected. This time, he seems to be looking someone in the eye, perhaps ruminating on how much of a non-person he now feels.
- The Jedi hanging in the town square. Wow, this is dark for Star Wars. John Williams absolutely killing it with the music again. I assume this is his work. It sounds reminiscent of "Schindler's List". This part of the episode is very emotional: very moving. It's like "The Passion Of The Christ". That might as well be Obi-Wan strung up there. What an awesome sense of futility and horror. Incredibly artistic and daring for Disney/LFL. MY GOD! The music is so beautiful. What is Star Wars going to be -- what are we going to be? -- when this quality of scoring is no more? Music is everything. This passage is a gripping testament to that foundational fact.
- The warning light goes red. So Obi-Wan goes back home at maybe his lowest point as a human (even lower, yes, than the most terrible moments for him in ROTS), and now, right now, when it is most urgently needed, a change must come. A change will come. A change has come. Bail Organa, father of Leia, and John The Baptist to Obi-Wan's Christ-like wilderness years, has personally arrived. Almost been beamed there, if you like, by the Force itself. A vision in a cave.
- A great bit of atonal string work in the score as Obi-Wan enters the cave with wariness.
- Obi-Wan approaching the strange figure with trepidation. Is it... could it be... might his Old Master...
- "She's headed for Daiyu." As if continuing the holographic transmission right where he left off. Of course, it is none other than Bail Organa. Obi-Wan looks a little surprised and sad.
- "I told you, I'm not the man you remember." - "Well, you're going to have to be!" (When a senator talks, you listen).
- "You made mistakes, we all did." I like how Bail grabs his beard in that moment.
- "It's the past. Move on, be done with it." Wow. Kinda like what Obi-Wan said to that hunted Jedi who he just saw hanging in the town square. Only, with Bail, it has a whole different meaning. In his righteous indignation, he is helping Obi-Wan be free of his burden -- free to open the door and walk past the worst of his pain and torment, free to put guilt and grief in their proper place. Just an awesome moment handled with wonderful poise thanks to Jimmy Smits. He is masterful in every scene.
- "You couldn't save Anakin, but you can save her." Yes, exactly. I love how Obi-Wan again looks away in pride and shame when Bail mentions his inability to save Anakin, as he did when Owen mentioned his name and reminded him he failed. But Bail brings a positive.
- "And what if I can't?" Moves me to tears. The catch in Obi-Wan's voice, the look in his eyes -- so haunting. This is what he fears most of all: not being good enough. Obi-Wan clearly feels he let down an entire galaxy and caused trillions of lives to be changed for the worse when he lost Anakin. So much pain, dread, and shame here. By far, this is the most human portrait of a Jedi ever, even surpassing Luke's depiction in TLJ, I think.
- "There is no one I trust more with my child than you." What incredibly powerful words.
- "Please, old friend..." Ah, man. I love that they worked that phrase in there.
- "One last fight." And the sort of nervous twitching of Obi-Wan's facial muscles at the end. He's going to do it. He can't promise anything, but he's not going to let his friend weep, or let himself terminally decay in ruinous grief, any longer.
- LOLA being dropped to the floor in malice. Boy, that hurts. Can't a ladybird and a flea get along?
- Obi-Wan retrieving the sabers he buried long ago. Awesome music again. Perfectly cinematic. The sad mood of this chapter has been gorgeously conveyed by the music on Tatooine. It almost makes other Star Wars entertainment from the last few years perish into nothingness. The imagery and music combine so well.
- But, um, I do have a question: Now, the imagery and music are, indeed, excellent, and I love the whole concept. However, how does Obi-Wan locate the sabers, exactly? And how come they only seem to be buried about two feet deep? It would have worked better if he had some kind of tracking device or lightsaber-sensitive crystals or something. As it is, he just dismounts from his eopie, takes out a small shovel, and after a very short amount of digging, the box is uncovered seemingly as he left it years ago.
- "This is a bad idea. Kidnapping kids?" Interesting how this super-brief scene of the villains is intercut with Obi-Wan recovering the sabers. I mean, the Jedi were essentially all taken as children, were they not?
- "He fought beside her father in the war." So Reva knows that Bail and Obi-Wan worked together to preserve democracy in the Republic? It's otherwise a very outlandish gambit. Of course, if she knew they'd hidden Luke and Leia, or that Padme had had twins, that would be stretching the lore. That would basically be game over. This is in-between perfect knowledge and perfect ignorance. What a cunning little plan on her part. Feels suitably villainous.
- Obi-Wan walking through the town square and looking more Jedi than ever. And sort of a mixture of PT Obi-Wan and OT Obi-Wan. This really sells the idea that it's happening in the middle of the two trilogies.
- So Obi-Wan has a pass/chip in his hand? Whatever he's holding wasn't shown previously. And no close-up is provided. Not sure Lucas would have done it this way.
- "Well, you coming or not?" Indeed, to be Obi-Wan, or to not be Obi-Wan, that is the question. Of course, Obi-Wan must accept and can't turn back and refuse his old friend now.
- That flash of the saber! Wow, very Sergio Leone-esque, and perhaps just the final touch this episode needed. While it's maybe a bit reckless for Obi-Wan to flash his saber like that, a part of him seems to want to be known as a Jedi. As he passes under the arch, he rekindles a vital part of himself. And off on this grand adventure we go.
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Post by jppiper on Jun 8, 2022 4:15:44 GMT
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 8, 2022 7:01:32 GMT
Now some notes on my second viewing of the second episode:
Well, in truth, I don't have nearly as much to say about the second episode. The second episode, in comparison to the first one, is just sorta "there". It's considerably shorter than the first, lacks the first's ponderous and delightful qualities, is not as cinematic or as epic in its feel, and just doesn't seem to have nearly as much going on.
Daiyu makes for an attractive setting, and at least we spend the whole episode there (in the other two that precede and follow this, there is intercutting between different environments), but it ends up feeling cramped and small in its scale. It never really rises above the televisual, although the rooftop sequence is visually striking and fun, and fairly graceful as an action sequence. It feels like they saved a good chunk of their budget for this chase sequence. It's the one part with a certain fluidity and flair to it, and if there's a money shot moment in the episode, it must be Reva crouching on the edge of that rooftop with the bright neon sign behind her.
I also don't think we learn anywhere near as much about Obi-Wan in this episode, despite some little moments, as we do in the first episode. This second episode is somehow a lot more prosaic than the first: more blunt-trauma, compared to the soothing, melancholic poetry of Obi-Wan alone in the desert. We also lack the acting talents of Jimmy Smits and Simone Kessell in this outing. Of course, the highlight here is the amusing and touching dynamic between Obi-Wan and Leia. The episode wins big on this front, although there isn't a lot of breathing room. Before you know it, everything is over in a flash and Obi-Wan and Leia are leaving Daiyu behind.
Overall, this second episode, while still highly watchable and reasonably well-paced, just seems to be "getting the job done" (so to speak), with not a lot more to say for itself. I would definitely rank the first episode above it. Nevertheless, I still managed to write quite a few notes about it, as I just now discovered. Here they are:
- The Obi-Wan logo again. Gotta mention this again. I do love the series logo and the little animation. Very classy.
- The approach to Daiyu reminds me of the approach to Kijimi in TROS and the shot of Anakin falling toward the dense industrial area of Coruscant in AOTC. The grey-green clouds are also a nice touch. Lots of potions and colourful smoke-bomb moments and hazes in this episode.
- Yeah, now, I have a criticism immediately. Or more of a lament, perhaps. Straight away, as soon as the ship lands, we cut to a street scene: a medium shot of Obi-Wan walking out of the station, datapad in hand. It just lacks scale compared to the first episode. We never really have a proper establishing shot of Daiyu as a sprawling city environment. We have the aerial shot of the ship approaching, then a three-second shot of it landing, then this. A lack of scale blights this episode. Daiyu never really comes alive. It is frozen in a televisual world. Think of all the wide city shots of Coruscant in the prequels. Nothing like that here. I appreciate they didn't quite have the same budget to realise things to the same level, but Daiyu suffers for it. The makers talked of Daiyu being Hong Kong-inspired. Well, fine. But Hong Kong is very notable for its seaport, hodgepodge feel. It's incredibly dense and many different urban styles are aggressively foisted together. Daiyu often feels like a small, controlled television set by comparison. Perhaps the birds being released in the rooftop shootout sequence are a metaphor to this end. Only in the rooftop part does Daiyu feel liberated and able -- a little bit more compared to its street scenes, at least -- to briefly take flight. However, it's still a real shakeup compared to Alderaan and Tatooine in the previous episode, and I appreciate it very much for that.
- Are those some West Coast liberal accents in the background while Obi-Wan is standing around? So much for an alien feel. Daiyu obviously summons up strong "Blade Runner" vibes, but the Ridley Scott film has a clamorous mixture of voices and dialects. This feels very cut-rate by comparison. I'm sorry to keep bashing Daiyu, because I want to like it more than I do. They could have put a bit more into it. Still, the wider shot here is nice.
- Oh, okay. The accent belongs to the first person Obi-Wan speaks to for directions. Fair enough. Also, what the guy is saying before Obi-Wan approaches him is pretty amusing: "I can do nothing about the weather on that planet."
- "Excuse me..." The ever-polite Obi-Wan. I guess it's kinda neat that these are his first spoken words in this episode. Manners go a long way.
- "You're in Daiyu, now. All signals in and out are blocked. People like their secrets out here." Oh, interesting. Kind of a contrivance to make clear that Obi-Wan must do some sneaking/sleuthing, but I like it. Since there is no cutting to another planet, maybe it's also a meta comment that this episode is more "boxed in" or something.
- A nice wide shot as the music soars. Now this is more like it. There aren't quite enough of these shots for my taste, but at least this precious shot gives some sense of scale going off into the distance.
- Shots of Obi-Wan looking around, trying to get some sense of the place, looking very Jedi and aloof from the goings-on around him. Nice.
- "If ever I needed guidance, Master, it's now." I like the little layers in this "prayer" to Qui-Gon. Is Obi-Wan just bewildered by the planet? Or might he be calling on Qui-Gon due to some inner turmoil he feels as he takes his first steps back into the world as a Jedi once more? A wonderful addition to the scene.
- "Spare any credits..." I wonder if that was Qui-Gon guiding him? As soon as Obi-Wan calls on his fallen Master, he finds a fallen clone. The clone asking for credits also recalls Qui-Gon bartering with Watto: "I have 20,000 Republic dataries."
- Does the clone recognise Obi-Wan? A blast from the past. In the next episode, Obi-Wan again sees a "familiar face", or an outline, when he hallucinates Anakin in the distance. In fact, if you include Bail and Breha calling him on his communicator and then Bail going directly to see him on Tatooine, that's every episode so far.
- Obi-Wan folding his cloak back on itself and pacing around in that folded-arms gesture he does constantly in the prequels. I love this. This series has already made me like and respect Obi-Wan more as a character. Perhaps that love was always there, but I was distracted in the prequels by other characters like Qui-Gon, Jar Jar, Anakin, Padme, and Palpatine. Here, in his own series, I finally appreciate the light of Obi-Wan and Ewan's portrayal.
- The stormtroopers barging Obi-Wan out of the way. The old vs. the new. From a fallen clone to the newest kids on the block. It's sad seeing the casual lack of respect to a once-great Jedi. To most people in this universe, he's nothing now. But, at least in learning to be anonymous on Tatooine, Obi-Wan is used to blending in. Obi has mastered the art of being a nobody, while secretly being a somebody.
- The greens and the yellows and reds behind Obi-Wan. As frustrating as it is not to get more wide shots of the place, what's offered of Daiyu is still enchanting. Of course, the lower levels of Coruscant are also evoked here, and I'm perfectly happy with that.
- God, those stormtroopers are assholes. Although "clearing a path" is actually what Obi-Wan is trying to do.
- Right before Obi-Wan encounters that girl selling spice (one of Ewan's real-life daughters as Obi-Wan searches for another missing daughter), there's a bright red light in the distance (red light district?), as well as the background being lit a hellish red behind Obi-Wan. I really like that.
- I like the names of those spices. Wait a minute: "Felucian". Ah!!! Since the girl offers Obi-Wan three spices (threes again!!!), I like to think she's describing the hallucinogenic personality of each prequel. Like consuming spice, we don't care so much about the external world when we're watching or contemplating the prequels, do we?
- "I was looking for my daughter. She was taken and she's on this planet." Whoa, very meta.
- "I was someone's daughter once, too." Owwwww.
- Bit of a plot convenience that Obi-Wan is given a free bottle of spice, although maybe we can excuse the fact that the girl gives him a freebie because he mentions looking for his daughter. Perhaps the girl is jealous that this "father" seems to care and she'd rather that he become like her? I gotta say, there's also a bit of a weird sexual solicitation vibe, even though the girl walks away and we don't see her again.
- "The Jedi are all gone." This is the second time Obi-Wan verbalises that the Jedi are extinct. The first time was with Teeka in the first scene of Obi-Wan speaking back in the first episode.
- Even the light has graffiti over it. I wonder what the graffiti says? Perhaps also a metaphor here for the light within Haja (and people generally), obscured/sprayed-over by the grime of Daiyu, but still shining.
- The introduction of Haja. I like it. He has rather a large, clean-looking room for such a grungy, dangerous planet. This is what I mean about the episode having a televisual feel. The planet sort of doesn't feel lived in enough. Although we might also interpret the relative sparse interior with its vacant spaces as a metaphor for the "space" of human potential and ethical flourishing. Haja operates from a table in the centre and scams people out of their money while sat down, looking his clients in the eye. The space around him emphasises the sparsity of his con, but also hints at the possibility for a more expansive morality to emerge.
- "I'm inside your mind." Ironically, Reva later probes Haja's mind for real and he looks violated and broken afterward.
- Obi-Wan watching in the shadows and easily cottoning onto the trick. Believable. It wouldn't take him long to realise what Haja is up to. He may have spent many years isolated on Tatooine, but Obi-Wan is no fool. Although, how did sneak inside? I suppose it doesn't matter.
- "The Force is so strong with you." - "Yah, I know." HAHA! Haja's a little pathetic, but also quirky.
- "With your son's abilities, they will come for him." I like Obi-Wan's little reaction there. In another age, before the Dark Times, this kid might have been a Padawan in the Jedi Order. Obi-Wan begins to realise what is at stake in the galaxy.
- Haja's eyebrow gestures. LOL. The character is a tad wacky, but it seems to work here.
- "Be safe, little one. Be safe." That actually sounds sincere on Haja's part. Of course, Obi-Wan isn't impressed. Maybe Obi-Wan himself is slightly too cynical to see all there is in Haja yet.
- "I'm gonna take a quick break, okay?" Damn. Even a hustler has to work for his bread in Star Wars. I guess Haja and the other people he works with don't really make much from their scamming overall.
- "The shadows are my realm, for the light is an unforgiving place for my kind." So this is Haja's poetic rationalisation for charging people to help them with his "Jedi" powers. He could also be describing the Inquisitors. Reva, at least.
- "Goodness, that light is unforgiving." HAHA! People who say that this version of Obi-Wan lacks "prequel" Obi-Wan's sense of humour are wrong. He is still the sardonic, swashbuckling Jedi Master underneath it all.
- "I got them safe. Just a little... poorer." Haja is impish, but not cruel or dark-hearted. Perhaps, deep down, Obi-Wan does actually realise that. Leaning on Haja for his help wouldn't otherwise make huge sense.
- "Yeah, I'll do it." He says that real fast, doesn't he? Obi-Wan's look of slight surprise. Also, nice blaster, Obi. So uncivilized. But hey, it's Daiyu, what you gonna do?
- Another shot of a rat running around. There was also the desert rat on Tatooine.
- I dunno, but these next few street shots feel a bit small. It's here where Daiyu really starts to feel like a TV set. Ewan is doing his best to look mystical and curious, but even his acting can't disguise the fact that he's in a television show, not something with the scale of the prequels. Oh, well.
- The drugs lab is something different for Star Wars, but it looks okay for what it is: another cramped TV set. The colours are to be appreciated. Everything on this planet seems to have the same bright colours. I don't mean that negatively. It's interesting. Even the drugs must match the neon signage.
- Obi-Wan causes that blue concoction to explode for a distraction. It's a similar colour to the drink he downs at the bar in the Outlander Club in AOTC. Just thought I'd mention that. I guess there also isn't much security in this place.
- "Hey, what are you doing back here?" Uh oh, Obi-Wan's first fight incoming.
- "I seem to have lost my way." Metaphorically speaking, you indeed have, Obi-Wan.
- "Yeah, well, get back to work." Yeah, loser. Work is work and there is nothing more supreme in the universe. Ah, I love this motif. Obi-Wan didn't stand up for that guy on Tatooine in his job, but now he's through "working" for a living.
- Can I say how satisfying it is that the guy telling Obi-Wan to get back to work, and the first person he punches (well, okay, second), and the first he knocks unconscious, looks like the same species as Darth Maul? Defeating Maul was the first big step Obi-Wan took to becoming a "man" (or getting knighted) in the prequels, and DM was going to feature as the main antagonist in this series originally, until all that work was thrown out and they went with Inquisitors instead. So this guy is pretty meta.
- There was a mildly shocking quality to watching Obi-Wan go to work on these random grunts on my first viewing. Obi-Wan crying out in pain is interesting. He's not used to fighting anymore. Given that, he still handles himself fairly well.
- Those deep-blue corridors. Yeah, the set design is a touch anonymous, but reasonable for what it is. Also, Obi-Wan's tunic is a similar shade. He is quite well-camouflaged with his surroundings. There is also a lot of lens distortion visible at the edges of the frame. I guess they used a wide-angle lens to try and make the set look bigger and more cinematic.
- Obi-Wan gets tricked by a fake Leia, just like her mother in the first episode. Again, slight resonance with the prequels and Padme's use of decoys, besides the obvious cliche of the person the rescuer thinks is the person isn't actually them.
- "Where is the girl?" I love how Obi-Wan springs to life in that moment. The idiot villain gives the game away by bragging and casually name-dropping the Inquisitor to Obi-Wan. Also whilst holding his lightsaber. Not very smart, this fella, is he?
- "You're not a Jedi anymore, Kenobi. You're just a man." That's really the crux of it all. To be a Jedi is to be more than than simply human. It was this paradox that crippled Anakin in AOTC. The Obi-Wan series is exploring the idea that you can be both. Obi-Wan is just a man, but he's not just any man. Once a Jedi, always a Jedi.
- "Well, everybody bleeds." Obi-Wan always fools people with his courtly manners. This seems to be the moment Obi-Wan reconciles the fact that he's weak and mortal, but that there's more to him than that. He begins to move through the episode with more purpose.
- "Move." Reva flashes her Inquisitor saber and the bouncer understands. Man, I wanna try that sometime. And back to Obi-Wan -- always on the move...
- Okay, so the first meeting between Obi-Wan and Leia starts with Leia winding him and trying to get away. I also like how she's dressed in white here, just as she is when Luke comes and "rescues" her in ANH.
- "Your father sent me." Look at the way Obi-Wan steps backward and sort of extends his arms and torso. This is the same gesture he makes after his big bout of lightsaber parries against Grievous, marking the moment the clones arrive on Utapau. Which is interesting because Leia asks...
- "Where's the army?" Obi-Wan doesn't need an army. He's a one-man army.
- "Come..." The way he reaches forward for Leia's hand (and the framing) is a very Jedi moment.
- The camera pivoting around the red neon sign in the next shot is a nice bit of cinematography.
- Some of the costuming is also very nice here. The woman on the left with the red hat is interestingly attired. There's a lot of good costuming in this episode, but there isn't much chance to appreciate it, because most of it just happens in the background and isn't focused on very much. A bit like Canto Bight in TLJ.
- Is Flea speaking in Russian? The blue lighting for the shot of Reva opening the door looks good.
- "You seem kinda old and beat up." Kinda reminds me of Luke insulting the Falcon when he first sees it in ANH. As well as Leia insulting Luke for being short for a stormtrooper.
- "You have no idea what I'm risking being here, Your Highness." Yes. Your whole identity as a dejected loner in the desert, Obi-Wan? Oh, and Luke, of course. So, first, we had the meta moment with that Darth Maul dude, and now the show is kinda lampshading the fact that Obi-Wan leaving Tatooine is a big break with the established continuity of him protecting Luke. I like that it gets some passing acknowledgement here. Leia obviously has no clue what he's talking about. I also like how he calls Leia "Your Highness".
- Reva just pushes that guy over. Hey, she's an Inquisitor, and an impatient one, so why not? She ain't here to take any shit. Speaking of which...
- "You would kidnap an Imperial Senator's child?" Yes, she would. I like how this line establishes the Grand Inquisitor's disgust at Reva's actions, as well as giving a baseline for what is considered out of line in this timeframe, even for an Inquisitor.
- "I found a link between him and Organa in the Archives." Oh, right. "Him" referring to Obi-Wan presumably. I guess that's how natural Reva takes it to be that her obsession with Obi-Wan is perceived by the other Inquisitors as her sole focus in life.
- "I used the girl as bait." I mean, c'mon, the Jedi used her biological mother as bait in the prequels.
- "She thinks she will gain favour by capturing Kenobi." Reva's reaction there.
- "Whatever power you are... craving, it will not change what you are." There's almost a hint of the Emperor's Theme there. And the rebuke is interesting because it kinda sums up Anakin pledging himself to Sidious. Power alone doesn't fix anything.
- "The least of us." You have to feel for Reva a little bit there. She looks around with an anguished expression and realises it's her vs. the other Inquisitors. She is now isolated from them.
- "Your ability gave you station..." I love how The Grand One talks. Rupert Friend totally owns this role. And yes, as much of a dick as he's being, it's good to see someone reining Reva in. The Inquisitors still operate according to a strict code, and Reva, like Anakin, seems to care little for it.
- "Maybe that stench is your failure." Reva has balls. She was much more humble around the GI on Tatooine. This isn't going to be the only time the GI accuses Reva of having a "stench". But the second time will be the last.
- "You are no longer required, Sister." That little widening he makes with his eyes. Oh, man. The GI is such a good villain on his own terms. Such a simmering presence. Shame he hasn't been in these episodes very much.
- Can I just say I appreciate the lighting on the floor? Daiyu does look pretty incredible in some ways.
- Reva looks very alone at the end of the scene. The way she has her head tilted backwards, the little flaring of her nostrils. If she weren't so cold and brutal, she might be on the verge of giving into tears.
- LOL. The publicity still of Obi-Wan from ROTS is now officially an in-universe shot of him. I dig it. Again, this series has a neat relationship with the prequels. It bites into every prequel morsel it needs to authenticate itself as a continuation. And I love it.
- The scene also establishes that Flea himself isn't a bounty hunter. Good. He seems way too clumsy and cretinous for that occupation. However: Who is he? An administrator?
- It may be apropos of nothing, but the display screen shows a green progress bar overlaid atop Obi-Wan's picture. Green for Qui-Gon? A Jedi "charging" himself back to full strength? Also, there are two yellow indicator lights, like the Tatooine suns. Obi-Wan is the Jedi beneath the twin suns. The sand dweller. Obi-Wan Kenobi.
- Reva going all-out here to capture Obi-Wan. Fuck her boss. She knows what needs to be done.
- Obi-Wan seeing his younger self on the display screen of a datapad is kind of a meta moment.
- "Here... a little green... cape." - "You don't need those." - "And the gloves."
- Seeing Obi-Wan buying clothes with coins is kinda cool. Like wisecracking Jawas, I didn't know I needed this until I did.
- "What?" HAHA! They totally aced this relationship between Obi-Wan and Leia. Obi's comment here is also a straight throwback to Anakin backchatting him in Padme's apartment in AOTC.
- "Don't smell anything. Don't look at anything. Don't touch anything." Star Wars and threes!!! Obi-Wan is being quite the firm father in this stretch and I love it. It's also like Obi-Wan cautioning Anakin before he sets off with Padme in AOTC: "Don't do anything without first consulting either myself or the Council."
- That insectoid bounty hunter is pretty awesome.
- "Why aren't you using your lightsaber?" Obi-Wan actually doesn't use his saber till near the end of the third episode against Vader. Good restraint. Also, the moment after Leia says this, there is a bright green sign behind Obi-Wan. Possibly another little reference to Qui-Gon.
- "Well, that's my name." Ewan again just being a joy in every scene.
- "How old are you?" - "Ten!" - "You don't sound like you're ten."
- Obi-Wan and Leia are honestly such a great duo. They must all have had fun writing and directing this stuff. You can tell they were waiting to unleash it on fans and bask in the response. For all the people complaining of Disney's "woke" agenda, I'm not one of them. Not this time. This is great.
- Obi-Wan seeing those three bounty hunters. Leia doesn't realise the danger they're in. There's some good tension in this part. Now that I think of it, this whole passage rather effortlessly juggles comedy and danger.
- "Ooh, that's embarrassing." So this scene makes it seem like Haja is going to get to Obi-Wan and drop him into the villains for a juicy reward, but that's not what happens. I also like how he's working with that kid, in a mirror of Obi-Wan running around with Leia.
- "Come on..." The yellow lighting on Obi-Wan there as he passes under a street light is awesome. I've bitched that Daiyu seems a bit small, but a lot of the little touches are very eye-catching.
- "I want a garrison here within the hour." Like when Vader threatened to leave a garrison at Cloud City.
- "Kenobi is the last ember of a dying age." Shades of Tarkin: "Their fire has gone out of the universe."
- The little blue glow on the GI's face when he's shown the hologram of Obi-Wan. Man, I love the lighting in this series!!!
- Reva crouching on the rooftop looking for her prey. FUCK. YEAH.
- "No noise from that!" Obi-Wan being the bossy parent again. Love it.
- "Her name's LOLA and she won't make any. She's hurt." - "Good."
- Obi-Wan looking guilty and asking Leia about LOLA and bonding. They needed this little scene, not to mention a small respite in the whole pursuit sequence.
- A red beam plays across Leia's face as she turns angry toward Obi-Wan. I love this. Fear, doubt, anger, aggression. These are all the Dark Side. The sudden decline in their connection, after they just strengthened their bond, is well done. It fits also the shadowy, shifting world of Daiyu. Poor Obi-Wan. He's being hunted on the one hand for being a much-wanted Jedi, and now the girl he's protecting rejects him on the opposing basis that he's a fraud.
- "They took me to get to you." Well, she's pretty intuitive, you gotta give her that.
- "Your father is a very old friend." Ah, yeah. He is, he truly is. But it sounds like Bail hasn't mentioned Obi-Wan much to her.
- I really like the chase scene and Leia running through the streets of Daiyu. The chase sequences have already been bashed and shredded online for being slow and silly, but I think they're credible enough. Leia is pretty nimble, ducks under that display rack (like sliding beneath the tree branch on Alderaan), and there are a lot of people the fully-grown Obi-Wan is trying to get past. The one moment that does feel a bit convenient, though, is how Leia slips right past Obi-Wan after he shoots that bounty hunter. She is blatantly within grabbing distance and Obi-Wan just let hers get away again. Still, they put good details into the chase. It's basically from the perspective of a little girl in a world beyond her comprehension and I really like that. Has the right fish-out-of-water, fairy-tale dimension to me.
- Leia climbing the ladder is like her climbing the tree on Alderaan. She's again retreating from people she perceives to be nasty or deceitful and trying to free herself to a higher level of being. This is great as it leads to what I think is the best part of the entire episode: the chase along the rooftops.
- "Wait..." Obi-Wan climbing the ladder after Leia. I guess Leia has the high ground. Sorry, couldn't resist.
- Those floor markings in the next shot of the stormtroopers marching through the street in formation. Pretty neat.
- "Leia! Leia!" Obi-Wan says that a lot in this little sequence.
- The rooftops look so beautiful. This sequence makes Daiyu seem more convincing. More like an actual place with a geography and logic all its own.
- When that bounty hunter appears, getting ready to fire, you immediately see the danger Leia is in and how much she actually needs Obi-Wan's protection. Despite Internet complaining, this isn't a case of "Girl don't need no man".
- The laser fire and the sound of the laser fire are both freakin' awesome. Fuck, I love me some Star Wars. Then there is Reva reacting to it. The episode reaches a new level of excellence in this part. Very well directed with surprisingly good effects work. This seems to be where a chunk of the budget went.
- Reva again against that sign. Damn!!!
- Reva "falling" into the action. Fantastic.
- The insectoid bounty hunter re-appearing and getting into the action. Oh, shit.
- Hitting that container with laser fire and the birds flying out!!! Whoa, fantastic visual. Although this was given away in the trailer, it's really fluidly integrated into the action and even more satisfying than seeing it before. A brilliant touch.
- Haja on the roof. Come on, Haja, be a hero.
- Obi-Wan pinned in from two sides. What the fuck is people's problem online? The series is already being trashed for having poor action. I really don't get it. This action sequence may be short-lived, but it's brilliantly done.
- Reva's parkour moves. I love them. This is everything she's been waiting for. This is her moment.
- Reva using the Force on that scaffolding. So cool.
- "Leia, no!" Too bad, Obi-Wan. She's gonna do it.
- "Hold on tight." Notice the little gripping action Obi-Wan performs with his hand. That's more Vader-like if anything.
- This little part is a bit drawn-out, but I guess Obi-Wan sees/feels Leia falling in slow-motion and has time to reach into the Force and slow her. Ironically, he grants her her wish and finally makes her float.
- "You... you really are a Jedi." Well, at least she realises her earlier mistake and now begins to respect Obi-Wan: who he is, what he is, why he's come.
- Another mild touch of what sounds like two notes from the Emperor's Theme when Obi-Wan explains the Inquisitors to Leia. Another clear setup of Reva's past, too, when Obi-Wan says that many of them were Jedi who turned to the Dark Side. Also similar to Aragorn explaining to the Hobbits that the Ringwraiths "were once great kings of Men" in LOTR: FOTR.
- "Who are you?" That's the real question, isn't it? Interestingly, Haja reveals his "true" self right after Leia asks this question of Obi-Wan, saving them from the insectoid bounty hunter.
- "Do I like credits? Yah! There's so much stuff you can buy with credits." HAHA! He's pretty honest for a shady guy, isn't he?
- "Haja..." - "You remembered my name!" One of my favourite moments.
- Flea getting killed by the Grand Inquisitor. Brutal.
- Reva jumping down from the rooftops looks impressive, but couldn't she just use a ladder? How did Obi-Wan and Haja get down? I guess she's just impatient.
- Haja is very heroic here. He may be a somewhat pitiable guy, but he's trying to make amends, and standing up to an Inquisitor takes guts. Especially for someone with no obvious Force ability. There is, of course, the possibility that Haja believes he has some mild Force ability, through all his years of faking it. Unfortunately for him, Reva quickly disabuses him of this notion. Still, Haja's character underlines the importance of the Jedi in inspiring others to do good, no matter their station in life.
- I also like the little backstreet encounter as a setting and for the symbolism. The murky planet of Daiyu seems full of surprises. Many people with many goals and allegiances lurk here, even someone willing to momentarily stand up to an Inquisitor and the Dark Side might of the Empire.
- I appreciate how Reva doesn't actually do anything to Haja initially. She simply asks him to move out of the way. It is only when he insists he's the Jedi they're looking for that she realises he has a connection to Obi-Wan. Kinda shows how her threatening Owen in the first episode was ham theatricality. In reality, she's quite business-like. Of course, she has no qualms about invading Haja's mind. Although her reaction is interesting. She looks a bit sad and shaken as she probes and perhaps absorbs some of Haja's sorrow and emptiness. She appears to not be left untouched by this brief encounter.
- "This is a cargo port, it's not meant for people." That's all well and good, Obi-Wan, but Reva is onto you. Also, if the Inquisitors had any intelligence at all, wouldn't they demand the cargo port sealed? It seems like quite the lucky break for Obi-Wan and Leia that they can just stroll into this place on Haja's say-so.
- "What now?" And with that little shake of her head. This actress is so good in the role of young Leia.
- "You just remind me of someone. She was fearless, too." This whole speech is very moving and brings me quietly to tears. The whole remembrance of Padme is the key to the trilogies -- and, it seems, in many ways, key to the Obi-Wan series, too. Disney has gotten a few things wrong the past ten years, but a lot about this series feels very, very right.
- "No, she was a leader." I love how softly Ewan says that. When he tells Leia that "She died a a long time ago", my heart is breaking almost as much as if I were watching Padme's final scenes in the prequels again. Beautiful.
- Reva's arrival is brilliant and scary. The sickly yellow-green patch of light behind her, the Dutch angle, and her igniting the saber. Suddenly, it's like Obi-Wan and Leia are rats in a trap. How are they possibly going to get out of this?
- "Obi-Wan... I can feel you..." So menacing!!!
- Obi-Wan looks scared and clutches his saber for strength, for nourishment, for guidance. He won't use it, but it makes for a powerful totem that calls to mind the power he once wielded. The power that Reva now wields over him.
- "Your fear betrays you." Reva is just loving this. The balletic twirl of her saber here is again evocative of how Obi-Wan used to carry his weapon. Obi-Wan truly feels fucked in this moment.
- "You don't have to worry. You're not going to die... today." Reva is delighting in her own villainy. A terrific performance from Moses Ingram. Not sure what the haters are on about. The direction is really slick here, too. Nice effects work and lighting as her crimson blade lights up the nearby cargo containers.
- "I'm just going... to take you to him." Notice that Reva's ominous, deliberate speech patterns seem to echo the Grand Inquisitor's. She may despise her boss now, but she seems to have learned a lot from him. Typical situation of an apprentice being imprinted upon and finally surpassing their master.
- "Lord Vader will be pleased..." She hopes.
- "You didn't know?" And she actually seems to not know Obi-Wan didn't know. Watch her reaction. She appears to sense Obi-Wan's reaction through the Force. This whole sequence, in fact, has shades of Luke hiding from Vader in the Emperor's Throne Room in ROTJ.
- Obi-Wan's facial expressions as he learns the terrible truth. A truth that changes everything. Reva didn't need to use any physical violence against Obi-Wan. She has already done worse and scarred Obi-Wan for the rest of his days.
- "Third Sister! I can stand the reek of your ambition no longer." Rupert Friend in badass mode again. His intrusion also comes across a bit like a parent interrupting a sexual escapade.
- "I found him, we have him!" The desperation laced in Reva's voice is palpable. She is effectively giving her boss once last chance to accept her methods, her drive, her determination: to accept her.
- "Do you really think I'd let you take all the credit? Who's in the gutter now?" Very cold-blooded, but exactly like something a Sith, or a Sith wannabe, would do. Lucas always said that this is why the Rule Of Two exists. I also love Obi-Wan's reaction here. Reva murdering her boss shocks even him.
- In another brilliant demonstration of the futility of vengeance, which is a major theme of Star Wars, Obi-Wan narrowly escapes the clutches of Reva after she pointlessly murders the Grand Inquisitor and gloats over his gutted corpse. Had she worked with her boss or saved her vengeance for another time, they might well have captured him. Now, all Reva can do is pointlessly chase after the escaping cargo ship, screaming at the top of her voice that Obi-Wan cannot escape Vader and they will destroy him. There is little chance that Obi-Wan actually hears over the din of the engines. He's in far too much of a trance to pay the outside world any notice. Reva has scored a Pyrrhic victory and must live with the consequences. At the pinnacle of her quest to find Obi-Wan, she had him within her grasp and let him slip away.
- "What is it? Are you okay?" Leia remains very intuitive, much like her mother. The wonderful understatement of this question will drive the rest of the series to its firm resolution.
- Obi-Wan sinks into himself as he realises that Anakin still lives. The final shot of Anakin in the bacta tank is pure horror movie territory. Obi-Wan abandoned Anakin on Mustafar, consigning him to a terrible fate. It's the murmur in the Force he's been running from and trying to block from his mind ever since. Even all those years in the desert living a meaningless existence couldn't quell it completely. This is the story of the rest of Obi-Wan's life. This is Obi-Wan Kenobi.
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 8, 2022 9:04:24 GMT
In my opinion, it's clickbait nonsense. Let's break it down: First off, it links to a fuller article on The Wrap: www.thewrap.com/why-obi-wan-didnt-know-anakin-was-alive-vader-joby-harold/Now, as for the clickbait link itself: boundingintocomics.com/2022/06/06/obi-wan-kenobi-writer-appears-to-be-oblivious-of-revenge-of-the-sith-has-no-clue-kenobi-knew-anakin-was-darth-vader/(For this one, I'll just quote the relevant chunks). That's not what Harold quite says. They were mulling over the possibilities, naturally, before deciding on what was dramatically sensible. Read the fuller article above and the highlighted part again. Back to the hit-piece: Yes, this is all pre-Mustafar. Technically, I suppose Obi-Wan does know the moniker, and maybe Harold had forgotten about that scene initially. However, Obi-Wan never uses the name himself in ROTS. On Mustafar, he still calls Anakin by his human name. It's like he's in denial. It would probably be too much of a stretch, on the other hand, to pretend that Obi-Wan himself forgets the name of Vader altogether. Indeed, the series doesn't do that. When Reva mentions Vader in the cargo hold, Obi-Wan clearly knows to whom she's referring. He then quotes Harold from the article above, before going on to say: Which proves... what, exactly? Obi-Wan is speaking to Luke years later the fact and nothing in the dialogue suggests Obi-Wan knew that Anakin was alive. Let's examine it (as transcribed in the article): Note Obi-Wan's words: "To protect you both from the Emperor."The Emperor, not Vader. That was the main objective. The Emperor would clearly have an interest in Anakin's kids whether Anakin himself were living or dead. Thus, neither that line, nor anything else Obi-Wan says to Luke, can be presented as evidence that Obi-Wan knew that Anakin survived the events of Mustafar. Now, you might say, yes, but: Obi-Wan says "you were hidden from your father". However, the presumption likely was that the Dark Side, being what it is, can confer enormous strength on a person, and Anakin might have survived. But we're never shown either Yoda or Obi-Wan having any proof of that at the end of ROTS. I think the strongest indication of Obi-Wan believing Anakin survived in the prequels (in some respects, I accord them higher canon than the OT: e.g., the birth of the twins) is maybe when Obi-Wan says: "We must take them somewhere where the Sith will not sense their presence." The Sith being something of a plural connotation. Isn't he speaking, therefore, of both the Emperor and Vader? Yes, but the Sith are known to get new apprentices when it suits, and there were still plenty of scattered Jedi and other Force-sensitive folk about. In ROTJ, Obi-Wan is speaking from the perspective of hindsight, with years of history under his Jedi belt. The twins were hidden from all threats, with their father just posing one of many, and the Emperor being the main one. Obi-Wan simply ties the two together (but still mentions the Emperor as the main threat: THE PHANTOM MENACE) because, by ANH, he is aware that Vader is alive and kicking, so what he said back in ROTS looks even more prudential in hindsight. It's possible that Lucas was comfortable with Yoda and Obi-Wan both knowing that Anakin had survived as Darth Vader at the end of ROTS. After all, the redemption story of OT hinges on Luke getting through to Anakin and convincing him to renounce Palpatine and his dark dream of the Galactic Empire. But Lucas also seems to have left the gap between ROTS and ANH deliberately vague, such that various interpretations are possible. It was a good bet that Anakin was still out there, but with Obi-Wan and Yoda themselves going into hiding, there was little means they had of confirming it. They just knew they had to bide their time and wait for the right signal. Here are some more dumb complaints: Leia's ship fell under attack, as she says in the message, and perhaps she was unable to beam the plans to Alderaan because it was quickly blasted and incapacitated by the pursuing Star Destroyer. The same question could be asked of "Rogue One": Why not beam the plans straight there? Leia's ship is perfectly functional at the end of that film, yet they go straight into hyperspace and head for Tatooine. We've gotta give the new creatives some wiggle room. I'll admit that Bail and Breha communicating directly with Obi-Wan by hologram surprised me a little. I... didn't think that was possible. Still, whatever. Maybe they could only communicate certain types of information and not something as intricate or complex as the Death Star plans. Maybe it became too politically dangerous thereafter and they shut down those communication frequencies. I do like the touch of Obi-Wan's communicator being Qui-Gon's holographic transmitter. Maybe Obi-Wan modified it for emergency contact and it had a limited battery or something. Fans could do with using some imagination. I said it during the prequels, I'm saying it now.
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Jun 8, 2022 9:11:13 GMT
I saw that. This is pretty alarming. Apparently not even Pablo Hidalgo, who is supposed to be the Star Wars canon expert, realized that Obi-Wan knew Anakin is Vader. I raised the point that Obi-Wan knew Vader survived on Mustafar over at TFN, and got pushback from some members who claimed there is no indication that he knew. But that article contains the quote from RotJ that shows he knew: “To protect you both from the emperor, you were hidden from your father when you were born.” This is just inexcusable sloppiness on the part of Lucasfilm. Stuff like this happens when there's no one really in charge. This is also pretty disappointing: thedirect.com/article/obi-wan-kenobi-darth-vader-hayden-christensen-scenes-replacedI don't understand why they don't have the full confidence to use Hayden as Vader in all scenes. He looked great in the suit in RotS. Is the exact height of Vader such a sticking point? They had him bulk up and lightsaber train, but then replaced him so Vader could be "bigger" and had someone else do the lightsaber fight. I guess there's some resonance to Vader literally becoming a different person in the suit played by stunt doubles, and only flashes of Anakin/Hayden appearing. It's interesting that the stunt double says they are a symbiosis with Hayden. Vader is a symbiosis between man and machine. Boy do I have opinions on the fourth episode, but I'll have to ruminate on it a little bit.
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 8, 2022 10:25:52 GMT
I saw that. This is pretty alarming. Apparently not even Pablo Hidalgo, who is supposed to be the Star Wars canon expert, realized that Obi-Wan knew Anakin is Vader. I raised the point that Obi-Wan knew Vader survived on Mustafar over at TFN, and got pushback from some members who claimed there is no indication that he knew. But that article contains the quote from RotJ that shows he knew: “To protect you both from the emperor, you were hidden from your father when you were born.” This is just inexcusable sloppiness on the part of Lucasfilm. Stuff like this happens when there's no one really in charge. Explained above. Not the issue that some are making it. Fans look for flaws and are overly fixated on "canon". Hayden played Anakin, not Vader. Not seeing the problem. You have some wonderful thoughts on the situation (as highlighted). As I was finishing my notes for the second episode (by re-watching and pausing as I went -- so, okay I technically watched each episode an additional time, so that I could pause and write, pause and write), I saw the thumbnail for the fourth pop up. My plan was to hold off watching until the evening, until I was more rested, until I could kill all the lights. But, because I'm concerned with running into spoilers for this series based on my present net habits, I gave in and decided to watch it just now. My thoughts (after one watch)? Short and sweet. SPOILERSOkay, I won't really get into spoilers right now. Nothing heavy, anyway. All I'll say, for the time being, is that they really are doing that Saga-episode mirroring thing, aren't they?! In the first episode, many Episode I resonances, including the little girl from a pristine planet under threat in dire need of Jedi protection, and heavy Tatooine emphasis. The second episode, many Coruscant/underworld overtones on Daiyu and Obi-Wan performing an investigation. In the third, flashbacks to ROTS and the "monster" of Vader. In this fourth one (spoilers, folks), little Leia is rescued from the bad guys' big black fortress (including an aerial assault at the end). The whole series still feels too short at six episodes, but this mirroring thing is interesting. Can't wait to watch episodes five and six now.
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 8, 2022 10:59:22 GMT
I've just located another interview with writer Joby Harold on The Hollywood Reporter. It's much more detailed than the one above: www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-features/obi-wan-kenobi-leia-disney-1235160356/Yet another writer who admits to being more of an OT fan. Oh, well. I do like his intelligence. His thoughtful answers remind me of Chris Terrio's. I won't copy it all, but here's a part of relevance to the accusation that Harold is oblivious to Star Wars canon:
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