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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 24, 2022 12:02:36 GMT
Oh my word, I cannot believe an interviewer actually asked Ewan on the theory of Obi-Wan having an affair with Padmé. The gall of him 
The interviews have got spicy. No more soft balls 
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Jun 24, 2022 13:04:25 GMT
The last episode was so bad it literally gave me Covid.joking/not joking Cryo, are you having a similar moment with this series that I had with TRoS when I first tried to watch it? As you probably remember, I came around to it pretty quickly. Maybe you'll have a similar epiphany with this series. I am yet to watch the last episode in full, but I can tell from the clips I've seen that the Obi-Wan/Vader rematch isn't quite what was promised, so there is maybe some disappointment there. I'm still over the moon about Qui-Gon, so the series feels like it earned its place for me. But maybe I'll be more disappointed once the honeymoon phase is over. We'll see. |
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 24, 2022 13:33:26 GMT
The last episode was so bad it literally gave me Covid.joking/not joking Cryo, are you having a similar moment with this series that I had with TRoS when I first tried to watch it? Sort of. What I meant was I now actually have Covid. And yes, Arch Duke, it's been around since December 2019, and I haven't been ill with anything since then. Don't attack my precious TROS! It is innocent of all charges!  On a more serious note, people don't give a shit about wearing masks or keeping any kind of distance anymore, so catching it (especially in a public-facing job) is near inevitable. Anyway, at least I have a lot more free time now, since I'm now isolating and off work. Probably all those crappy shifts that gave me it. And that last episode...  The rematch is legitimately quite good, but don't go expecting the moon. You would probably have been better to go in unspoiled. It can't live up to their confrontation on Mustafar, and even their confrontation on the Death Star is more eerie in some respects, and far more succinct. Yet it delivers a touch of horror grandeur in its conclusive moments and I do like it for that. Gave the episode a re-watch earlier and I can see it has some highlights (but only, in my opinion, what I highlighted before). I respect everyone's connection to the prequels in here, I really do. They're such amazing, rock-solid films. However, it does seem that fans are relatively easy to bilk if a thirty-second Qui-Gon cameo is enough to validate the entire series, just because they saved it till the end. I feel a touch of Alexrd coming on, but this series plainly swerved from getting into any aspect of Jedi mysticism whatsoever. Even that Jedi faker, Haja, had more screen-time than Qui-Gon. I like Haja, but that's ridiculous. They kept teasing Qui-Gon and had Obi-Wan talking to him several times, but in typical Disney style, that's all it was: empty teasing. Obi-Wan also confronted immense hardship and clearly became lost; and even when he resolved to being a hero once more, desperate for his Master's guidance, he was met with silence on his entire journey here. Notice that the series is vague on whether there was ever any connection prior to the series. Did Qui-Gon stop communicating? Or did Obi-Wan spend all that time without a shred of guidance from him? Like so much in the series, it's never clarified. At least in TLJ, Yoda appears to Luke and they have a meaningful heart-to-heart, with Yoda instructing Luke and giving a message to the audience one last time. Nothing like that from this series. Obi-Wan doesn't even need Qui-Gon's guidance at the end, either. Seriously, what good is his Master communing with him if Obi-Wan has already regenerated himself as a Jedi and a man without him? Rian Johnson understood that a scene between Luke and Yoda could be fruitful and necessary. All of Obi-Wan's important growth has already taken place before Qui-Gon greets him at the end -- and inexplicably rebukes him for not being ready to see him? It would have been nice of Qui-Gon to uplift his apprentice and give him a few important morsels to ruminate on before he fell into his funk, don't you think? Like Obi-Wan's lost communicator, the series doesn't care to establish a coherent context for the dynamic between Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon. For all intents and purposes, there isn't one. |
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Post by Samnz on Jun 24, 2022 14:53:34 GMT
Cryogenic I am actually glad they stayed away from tampering with the Force. They would have only fucked that up, knowing that most people at Disney/ Lucasfilm have a very limited unverstanding of Star Wars. The Force should be restricted to be expanded by the Maker himself (I already hate all the nonsensical force stuff they made up in the ST) or, at the very least, Filoni who studied under and - contrary to JJ with his infamous self coming out as someone not getting anything while being completely oblivious to it "He loves his midi-chlorians" idiocy - listened to Lucas.
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Post by nickromancer on Jun 24, 2022 15:05:32 GMT
Cryogenic I am actually happy they stayed away from tampering with the Force. They would have only fucked that up, knowing that most people at Disney/ Lucasfilm have a very limited unverstanding of Star Wars. The Force should be restricted to be expanded by the Maker himself (I already hate all the nonsensical force stuff they made up in the ST) or, at the very least, Filoni who studied under and - contrary to JJ with his infamous self coming out as someone not getting anything while being completely oblivious to it "He loves his midi-chlorians" idiocy - listened to Lucas. Had to look up that midi-chlorians thing. JJ’s compulsive need for popular approval from the lowest brows pisses me off. you had the first new Star Wars movie and you were speaking to George Lucas about midi-chlorians and were like, Red Letter Media’s opinion is more important than my childhood hero. And then he was so excited for the sequel to his Star Wars movie. Until it got a lot of hate from those fans he loves, and now he wants to act like he was fighting against TLJ from day one |
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 24, 2022 15:17:23 GMT
Cryogenic I am actually happy they stayed away from tampering with the Force. They would have only fucked that up, knowing that most people at Disney/ Lucasfilm have a very limited unverstanding of Star Wars. The Force should be restricted to be expanded by the Maker himself (I already hate all the nonsensical force stuff they made up in the ST) or, at the very least, Filoni who studied under and - contrary to JJ with his infamous self coming out as someone not getting anything while being completely oblivious to it "He loves his midi-chlorians" idiocy - listened to Lucas. A part of me is glad they avoided it, too. However, it means that Qui-Gon is just tacked on at the end, adding nothing to the plot. The Order 66 flashback that opened the series was longer and had more happening in it. The Qui-Gon cameo strikes such a false note. And... He's an apparition, is he? I thought he couldn't do that, according to Lucas. So they didn't even listen to Lucas on that one basic thing. The series ended up breaking canon and making a boatload of idiotic decisions just for the cheap thrill of it. They didn't honour Lucas' storytelling or respect what had come before. They did their own thing and were incredibly sloppy with even their own choices. What a complete waste of time. |
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 24, 2022 15:19:15 GMT
Nitpicks- Obi-Wan should have been on Tatooine when Reva was pursuing Luke- what if she hadn’t had a change of heart? Reva living was appropriate to conclude her arc, which was done well, but it will create issues for the future Obi-Wan should have tried to appeal to Vader, maybe mentioning Padme
This bothers me more than anything else. I can get over the loose canon that is Reva, as I feared far worse would be done with her character in the finale: I'd heard someone suggest she would be revealed as having been Obi-Wan's additional padowan. This would have been a nightmare in retroactive continuity.
While it's not at my enormous level of disappointment in Anakin's sheer absence in the ST and trivialisation in TROS, I do think Padmé should have come up at least once in the conversation between Vader and Obi-Wan. It was, after all, the sudden intuition from Anakin that Obi-Wan and Padmé were plotting against him, that forever severed the two men's friendship. In truth, while Obi-Wan was planning to take him down, Padmé was not, still in disbelieve and shock as she put Obi-Wan's allegations to her husband, and desperately trying to get him to focus on their soon to be born children. While there's now no way Obi-Wan can convince him of the goodness of the Jedi Order, the evil of Palpatine, nor the democratic legitimacy of the Republic, and the canon prevents him from mentioning the twins, he can still invoke his wife, a person in both of their lives. A line pinging off what Padmé said on her deathbed would not have gone a miss, it would have seen Vader wavering for a moment, before Obi-Wan would mention another thing, and then Vader would reject him. This would be pleading, and I'm not sure we got that, even though the end product was still very emotional.
There were so many nods to Padmé in Obi-Wan's talks with Leia, some of the most tender moments of the entire series, I was convinced we were building up to the ultimate payoff. The only defence I can see from the writers in not putting it in there is that invoking her this early could risk Vader coming over to the light sooner that he needs in canon - or something like that. I disagree, it's only the confrontation with his son that he has the change of heart.
The only other people Obi-Wan could have are Ahsoka and Qui-Gon. In a much longer chat with Vader, which I was hoping for (they jumped into the fight way too soon), these names could have cropped up. Given that Ahsoka isn't fully integrated into the live-action world yet, that no live-action Clone Wars have been seen, I can understand why they would have been hesitant to bring her in. With regard Qui-Gon, it would have been more appropriate to have him speak pre-fight to Obi-Wan as a Force Ghost about failure, and Anakin (an inadvertent nod to TLJ).
According to the comics, according to Christensen's own thoughts, Vader never really forgets about his deceased wife, its always haunting him. I get that the story is fixed around Obi-Wan and Anakin, but come on, they've inserted Reva out of nowhere in this series. If Obi-Wan's going to plead with Vader one last time, and he's going to throw the kitchen sink at it, I'm afraid he doesn't quite do it here. As much as the two were Jedi brothers, two esteemed war veterans, and good friends, the love of Anakin's life was Padmé, and Obi-Wan damn well knew that. He's instead leaning more towards Old Ben, and the jerk he becomes in his TESB and ROTJ force ghost appearances. The OT, where Padmé is basically absent... |
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 24, 2022 15:29:42 GMT
I can get over the loose canon that is Reva, as I feared far worse would be done with her character in the finale: I'd heard someone suggest she would be revealed as having been Obi-Wan's additional padowan. This would have been a nightmare in retroactive continuity. Sure. But Reva is probably the reason the sixth episode didn't connect well to the fifth. Bail specifically said in the message he sent to Obi-Wan in the fifth episode that he was heading to Tatooine, and that's the message Reva herself discovers at the end of that episode, prompting her to find her way to Tatooine in the sixth (just... somehow...). But Bail isn't in the last episode at all until the very end, and no mention is made of him going to Tatooine by anyone, ever. WTF? They must have changed something here. As it stands, that's a legitimate plot hole: a blatant discontinuity where there's a clear setup but zero payoff. |
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Post by stampidhd280pro on Jun 24, 2022 15:37:24 GMT
Honestly, the Clone Wars series was like that on occasion, and they'd release a mini webcomic to explain the plot hole.
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 24, 2022 15:39:25 GMT
Honestly, the Clone Wars series was like that on occasion, and they'd release a mini webcomic to explain the plot hole. Well, yeah, you can always explain anything you want in Star Wars by introducing another piece of media. That's a pretty big hole in storytelling logic, though. And it pisses me off that Disney thinks this is an acceptable way to tell stories. The Obi-Wan series was marketed as a "limited series". Well, that phrasing was right in one respect. |
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Post by stampidhd280pro on Jun 24, 2022 15:54:26 GMT
Should've been a movie. Honestly, it's a massive time waste. I'm almost considering not including it in my Star Wars viewing order rotation because of that. But for now it goes:
Day One:
The Phantom Menace
Attack of the Clones
Day Two:
Revenge of the Sith
THX-1138
Day Three:
Solo
Obi-Wan I-III
Day Four:
Obi-Wan IV-VI
Rogue One
Day Five:
American Graffiti
A New Hope
Day Six:
The Empire Strikes Back
Return of the Jedi
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 24, 2022 16:21:02 GMT
I can get over the loose canon that is Reva, as I feared far worse would be done with her character in the finale: I'd heard someone suggest she would be revealed as having been Obi-Wan's additional padowan. This would have been a nightmare in retroactive continuity. Sure. But Reva is probably the reason the sixth episode didn't connect well to the fifth. Bail specifically said in the message he sent to Obi-Wan in the fifth episode that he was heading to Tatooine, and that's the message Reva herself discovers at the end of that episode, prompting her to find her way to Tatooine in the sixth (just... somehow...). But Bail isn't in the last episode at all until the very end, and no mention is made of him going to Tatooine by anyone, ever. WTF? They must have changed something here. As it stands, that's a legitimate plot hole: a blatant discontinuity where there's a clear setup but zero payoff.
Yeah, they could have brought Bail in a bit more. I would have liked to see him on Tatoinne too, whatever his plans were, though I'm not sure Owen and Beru would take too well to that, they're fairly stubborn people (the former has a bit of his step-brother in him). I did like that they softened the sassy uncle some bit by having him let Obi-Wan see Luke at the end. I can get the over the lack of Bail, it's not a real issue for me.
There wasn't enough Luke in this series, that's a legitimate complaint. I mean, if you hadn't seen the OT, you'd swear Leia was the main protagonist. And I'm sorry to break it to the girlboss feminists, but that's not her role. She's instead an important supporting character, albeit one with tough competition from Han, Obi-Wan and Vader.
Ever since Carrie passed away, people have building up Leia to the moon. I've already taken the OT fanboys to task for drooling over Vader's violence, I've called Obi-Wan a jerk in the flashbacks, it's only fair did that I share a little critique of Leia too. She's not the one who redeems Anakin Skywalker, and that's what the whole Original Trilogy is all about, at the end of the day. Episode I-VI is the Tragedy of Darth Vader. That's why Luke is special, he has the compassion of his mother.
If there's one thing I've picked up on from this press tour, it's that in real life Hayden very much embodies the spirit of Luke Skywalker. Pure gentleman, couldn't be more different from the bitterness and aggression of his character. Mark Hammill is a political junkie crossed with Haja.
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 24, 2022 16:53:42 GMT
Sure. But Reva is probably the reason the sixth episode didn't connect well to the fifth. Bail specifically said in the message he sent to Obi-Wan in the fifth episode that he was heading to Tatooine, and that's the message Reva herself discovers at the end of that episode, prompting her to find her way to Tatooine in the sixth (just... somehow...). But Bail isn't in the last episode at all until the very end, and no mention is made of him going to Tatooine by anyone, ever. WTF? They must have changed something here. As it stands, that's a legitimate plot hole: a blatant discontinuity where there's a clear setup but zero payoff. Yeah, they could have brought Bail in a bit more. I would have liked to see him on Tatoinne too, whatever his plans were, though I'm not sure Owen and Beru would take too well to that, they're fairly stubborn people (the former has a bit of his step-brother in him). I did like that they softened the sassy uncle some bit by having him let Obi-Wan see Luke at the end. I can get the over the lack of Bail, it's not a real issue for me. I did like Owen in this series. He showed clear affection for and a protective attitude toward Beru and Luke and it was good to see. I also liked him softening on Obi-Wan at the end. And his battling of Reva. Joel Edgerton was note-perfect in this. That said, Owen is such a miserable grump in ANH, he was almost too warm by comparison in this episode. The most unsatisfying aspect has to be the nice moment of Owen asking Obi-Wan if he wants to meet Luke and then Obi-Wan walking over to him, with the skyhopper toy in his hand, but not even a three-second shot of him handing it over to Luke. Owen earlier threw that same toy back at Obi-Wan in the first episode and told him to stay away. There needed to be a real moment where Obi-Wan meaningfully hands the toy to Luke this time and has a brief exchange with him. But there is literally nothing. The series was able to do some things very well, but kept messing up and failing to follow through on its own setups, leading to a flat and perfunctory end, in my opinion. It just feels like this thing never needed to be made and didn't really do much to justify itself. Thus my cynical attitude toward it now.
Exactly. Now, I was okay with Leia getting a lot of attention early on, but then the series started to lose me. I'd have been fine if they only really got to Luke in the last one, but actually developed his character a little bit, and his relationship to the Lars and this stranger, Obi-Wan. They didn't do that. Luke was merely used in the last episode as the token "damsel" in need of saving. It's so anti-Star Wars. When Leia needed rescuing in ANH, it was the guys (Han and Luke) who looked like they needed her assistance, once she was broken out of her cell. Lucas always balanced the plot elements and characters correctly without being glib or condescending. The gruff bartender in the cantina honestly has more personality than Luke in the Obi-Wan series. It's a little pathetic.
I agree. Leia wasn't always shown in a flattering light in this series, either. Her petulance on the rebel ship to Obi-Wan in the last episode just made her look childish. Yes, she is a child here, but it was just done for the sake of some empty conflict between her and Obi-Wan, in my opinion. She won't let Obi-Wan leave her? And what are you going to do about it, Princess? Ewan's acting wasn't very good there, either. His foppish "Leia!" lacked all spark and authority. Arguing in front of the other rebels with Roken wasn't a good look for a Jedi, either. He should have been more discreet and done it in private. The series had some very weird vibes. The elevation of Leia at the expense of Luke is typical Disney dross, unfortunately.
Hamill strikes me as kind of an asshole in real life. He is a great storyteller and people person, though. Hayden seems magnificently unpretentious and down-to-Earth. A thoroughly good guy.
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 24, 2022 18:00:21 GMT
I agree. Leia wasn't always shown in a flattering light in this series, either. Her petulance on the rebel ship to Obi-Wan in the last episode just made her look childish. Yes, she is a child here, but it was just done for the sake of some empty conflict between her and Obi-Wan, in my opinion. She won't let Obi-Wan leave her? And what are you going to do about it, Princess? Ewan's acting wasn't very good there, either. His foppish "Leia!" lacked all spark and authority. Arguing in front of the other rebels with Roken wasn't a good look for a Jedi, either. He should have been more discreet and done it in private. The series had some very weird vibes. The elevation of Leia at the expense of Luke is typical Disney dross, unfortunately. To be fair, TROS did start this. It was awfully try-hard, it's let's make Leia into Luke because we're desperate and we've no other ideas. Johnson contributed to creating this mess by killing off Luke, I should add, and anticlimactically at that. There is a new trope in modern Hollywood in general, a kind of one-upmanship, where the female character has to be made into a knock-off of the male one. Instead of letting the original characters thrive and fall according to their original merits, its like no, we must have gender equality, if they were distinct in the past, they must now be made the same. That's how we then end up with Mary Sues, they're so focused on trying to get their heroines to prove something, that they ignore the significance of weaknesses in creating characters (eg Rey: literally meaning King in Spanish)
I love female characters like Padmé and Ahsoka precisely because Lucas and Filoni never shied away from showing their faults, they're well rounded individuals. Padmé is a woman who makes terrible mistakes in her secret private life ("Married the wrong guy" - George Lucas in the AOTC commentary), while Ahsoka shares some of the impatience and petulance of her master.
I adored the performance of Vivian as little Leia. The stubbornness of the Uncle Owen character meant that there was no other choice but to make Leia the reason Obi-Wan would head off-planet, and I'm fine with that. I loved her interactions with Obi-Wan. The acting was superb for me.
Hamill strikes me as kind of an asshole in real life. He is a great storyteller and people person, though. Hayden seems magnificently unpretentious and down-to-Earth. A thoroughly good guy. He is as entitled to his political opinions as any of we are, however, when I visited his Twitter page a few times during this show to see some commentary from him, I was left rather disheartened to see not not a thing, and instead a long list of political grievances. Does he sit hours of the day in front of Cable news? If so, God help him, that can't be good for one's mental health - all that anger, all that frustration, all that rage towards your fellow citizens, ouch man. Surely he could have written a few things about Little Luke?
Mark is definitely a bit of a joker, if you'll excuse the pun. I'm not sure if he ever had a stab at a stand-up career, but I could see him trying it anyway. Nevertheless, it's worth noting that he's a much more agreeable fellow than Harrison Ford is. I would not even like to meet the real Han Solo (Ford essentially played himself in Star Wars), he's too much of a dick. I've met a lot of these people, they're not the people you stay friends with for long, the novelty of the aloofness wears off quickly.
I remember reading in the 2000s that Carrie was a Republican. I guess like Mitt Romney, the blue-checkmark world had a change of mind on her - it's nice when people can put aside political differences for once (a tip for you Mark). She definitely had a difficult life at times, I think that's where a lot of the sympathy and support for her comes from. Ford has had it far easier as a megastar. We can forget that acting world isn't a smooth ride for everyone.
I've always been a far bigger fan of the demeaner of the PT cast. The politeness of Hayden, the graciousness of Ian, the articulate Natalie, the grateful Samuel, the Lucas admirer of Liam, it's a wonderful bunch of human beings. While admittedly Ewan has been fairly boisterous in the past, he's been nothing but appreciative of prequel fans during this press tour, and if he was more ambivalent before, he's certainly not now, there's been an epiphany of some kind.
Whilst the trio of the PT might not have been the super sarcastic, super extroverted trio of the OT, I'm fine with it, I even prefer them. The prequels had their own unique energy, their own skill-set, their own philosophy, never trying to be a shameless rehash of the originals, and we can see it reflected in the cast. One of the main reasons I lay into Marvel as much as I do is because of its ridiculous, forced humour. For whatever odd reason, modern audiences seem to lap that thing up, and they wanted that in the prequels too. They wanted these hyper realistic, very American, extroverts, and they didn't get it. Instead we got something more low key, more subtle, more otherworldly - in essence, something more resemblant of the person George Lucas really is.
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Post by Cryogenic on Jun 24, 2022 18:35:12 GMT
I agree. Leia wasn't always shown in a flattering light in this series, either. Her petulance on the rebel ship to Obi-Wan in the last episode just made her look childish. Yes, she is a child here, but it was just done for the sake of some empty conflict between her and Obi-Wan, in my opinion. She won't let Obi-Wan leave her? And what are you going to do about it, Princess? Ewan's acting wasn't very good there, either. His foppish "Leia!" lacked all spark and authority. Arguing in front of the other rebels with Roken wasn't a good look for a Jedi, either. He should have been more discreet and done it in private. The series had some very weird vibes. The elevation of Leia at the expense of Luke is typical Disney dross, unfortunately. To be fair, TROS did start this. It was awfully try-hard, it's let's make Leia into Luke because we're desperate and we've no other ideas. Johnson contributed to creating this mess by killing off Luke, I should add, and anticlimactically at that. There is a new trope in modern Hollywood in general, a kind of one-upmanship, where the female character has to be made into a knock-off of the male one. Instead of letting the original characters thrive and fall according to their original merits, its like no, we must have gender equality, if they were distinct in the past, they must now be made the same. That's how we then end up with Mary Sues, they're so focused on trying to get their heroines to prove something, that they ignore the significance of weaknesses in creating characters (eg Rey). I both agree and disagree with you here. It's true that TROS did turn Leia into something of a Luke clone. However, a lot of this couldn't be helped, due to Carrie's untimely passing. Moreover, they were always planning to make Leia the main OT cast member of the final film (Han gets the honours in TFA and in TLJ it's Luke). The leaked Trevorrow-Connolly script gives Leia more to do and more of her personality shines through, but they couldn't make that script after Carrie passed away. They were really in a tough position. I think I agree with you more strongly on the Hollywood sin of creating overpowered and uninteresting female heroines at the expense of believable, compelling weaknesses. Characters are meant to suffer and strive. Main characters, anyway. There's otherwise nothing to relate to. People's contempt for Rey is real and obvious.
Most of the acting was good. Ewan and Vivian had strong chemistry together. But it seems they didn't want to explore their options for any kind of interaction between Obi-Wan and Luke; or even Luke and his foster parents. Yes, Owen's stubbornness made Leia the more logical choice, but the series still chooses to show him softening to Obi-Wan in the penultimate scene, and yet nothing is really made of that moment, other than shoving a trite "Hello There" meme in there for nostalgia purposes.
Was there really much for him to say about Luke in this series? I agree that over-consuming news content isn't a good idea and has maybe made him more crotchety or intolerant. It's usually the end result. That said, I probably agree with him on most things, but I also haven't checked any of his accounts in a year or more. As funny as Hamill can be, I'm just not that interested in what Star Wars celebrities have to say. Once in a while, I'll take a look, but that's usually it.
Yeah, I'm the same way with those types. Then again, most people are aloof to me, or full of empty niceties. There's a horrifying lack of substance in the world that can only be compensated for with books and deep dives into topics within focused communities.
I like Hayden and Ian, Liam's always been wonderful, and Samuel is an exceptionally smart man, but I don't really put any of the cast on that much of a pedestal. If I had a favourite, I think it would be Ahmed.
I love this!!! That's exactly right. We're really on the same page here. Linking the low-key acting style of the prequels up with GL's personality is a beautiful observation. It's why Star Wars can never really go back, unfortunately, to the way it was. That said, there's no excuse to turn it into hyper-extroverted Marvel drivel, either. You and I really share the same tastes here. Lucasian Star Wars isn't just engrossing, it's soothing. As Anakin says to Padme in AOTC. All his characters tend to exude a quality of poise and restraint; even the most disgusting ones. They may have tried to recapture some of that in the Obi-Wan series with Ewan's performance, but it didn't always come across very well for me. I was thinking about this earlier. Ewan's Obi-Wan is mostly soft-spoken in the prequels, but he's occasionally driven to anger, like Jesus overturning the money changers' tables in the Temple. We never really saw Obi-Wan getting legitimately angry in this series. Irritated? Yes. Righteously furious? No. Lucas really understood the power of light and dark, sun and shade. His movies are so well-calibrated and finely-tuned. I really miss that in the Disney era. |
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Post by jppiper on Jun 24, 2022 20:33:48 GMT
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 24, 2022 20:56:49 GMT
I love this!!! That's exactly right. We're really on the same page here. Linking the low-key acting style of the prequels up with GL's personality is a beautiful observation. It's why Star Wars can never really go back, unfortunately, to the way it was. That said, there's no excuse to turn it into hyper-extroverted Marvel drivel, either. You and I really share the same tastes here. Lucasian Star Wars isn't just engrossing, it's soothing. As Anakin says to Padme in AOTC. All his characters tend to exude a quality of poise and restraint; even the most disgusting ones. They may have tried to recapture some of that in the Obi-Wan series with Ewan's performance, but it didn't always come across very well for me. I was thinking about this earlier. Ewan's Obi-Wan is mostly soft-spoken in the prequels, but he's occasionally driven to anger, like Jesus overturning the money changers' tables in the Temple. We never really saw Obi-Wan getting legitimately angry in this series. Irritated? Yes. Righteously furious? No. Lucas really understood the power of light and dark, sun and shade. His movies are so well-calibrated and finely-tuned. I really miss that in the Disney era.
Thank you. It all comes back to what you said yourself many moons ago, which I'll paraphrase, and that is that some people, of a certain persuasion or personality, tend to gravitate towards the PT. There's an old fashioned charm about these films (note, old-fashioned doesn't necessarily imply regressiveness) that a lot of us love, a sense of elegance and splendour, idealism and romanticism. While I'm not without criticism of them, especially in ROTS, there's a strident stoicism, and a great sense of weight and purpose behind the portrayal of the Jedi Order. They are guardians of peace and justice in the Galaxy, and there is a true feeling of order and serenity in the worlds we see. It is a civilised age, it is peak Rome, it is the Belle Époque, there is even a childlike wonder personified in Anakin, and it doesn't seem like anything could go wrong. Until eventually, of course, it does. In Palpatine, we have the manifestation of that terrible, gruesome spectre known as cynicism, the apostle of realism, and it will eventually creep up and swallow entirely our beautiful, if somewhat decadent, world of the second trilogy. I think those with a fondness for history and especially Romanticism (the literature movement), are particularly suited to the prequels. Oh, how Byron would have adored the prequel trilogy! He'd immediately recognise the opulence and folly of the late Republic.
I don't appreciate the way people confuse fantasy and science fiction. It's as if fantasy must only take place in an imagined version of Middle Ages Europe, and the former only in Space. How narrow-minded! To me, they are night an day, like the schools of romanticism and its successor realism, they inhabit distinct narrative logics and competing perspectives. Science Fiction can be insightful and truthful, but sometimes sliding into nihilism, while fantasy can be thoroughly imaginative and uplifting, yet terribly naive.
I loved McGregor's portrayal of Obi-Wan in this series. Yes, it was different, maybe even foreign at times for some viewers, but for me it was a change comparable to how the character went from Episode I (Padowan) to that in II and III (Jedi Knight and Master).
If there's ever a season two I would expect, in fact, I would demand it, to be swapping Leia out for Luke. Old Ben would be given permission to escort Luke for protection, whilst something troublesome was happening in the Lars' part of Tatooine. Very much mirroring the style of AOTC, as you may have guessed. Something would then go wrong. Of course, I'd also a demand a namecheck of Padmé, haha.
Even if I would have have liked more balance to the twins screen time, I still take Leia over the inquisitors any day. She's a very important part of the Skywalker family.
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 25, 2022 1:09:23 GMT
Well said, Molly! It may be far from perfect, and what a huge opportunity missed in the Obi-Wan - Vader duel, but it's still the best Star Wars has done to honour Padmé in 17 years. Remember how the character was minimised in posters only a few years ago, and overshadowed by several animated ones? Baby steps, I guess.
Hayden is a big fan of his on-screen daughter:
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Post by stampidhd280pro on Jun 25, 2022 2:45:41 GMT
You're focusing on the negative. They *were* trying to please us.
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Post by jppiper on Jun 25, 2022 3:16:08 GMT
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