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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 15, 2022 10:30:28 GMT
Opening shot of the 5th episode:
Sees my favourite Star Wars planet
**takes deep breath**
This is where the fun begins
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Post by Ingram on Jun 15, 2022 11:32:10 GMT
"Where were you..while he was killing my friends?"
"Well, if I recall, I was riding a giant iguana." - I'm sure many are savoring to draw parallels with The Last Jedi but, me personally, all I could think about the moment Reva strutted to the front line of all those Stormtroopers was Janet Jackson's Rhythm Nation video. Man would it have been cool if they all at once busted into some fly dance choreography—cut to inside the hangar doors on Obi-Wan's blank expression hearing muffled dance-pop. - Did they really just call her Reva as a clever play on the word "reveal"? From a writing standpoint it landed with all the shock of a 'Rey-is-Palpatine' moment. The scene might have played better had her extreme closeup not been muddled and poorly lit. By the way... - That whole siege shootout battle was a dumpster fire of shit camerawork. Why. I just... I can't wrap my head around it, why the industry continues to believe this technique is of such effect it warrants a universal default. They've been doing budgeted TV on mounts and dollies for the better part of the medium's history. Hey, crew, wild idea: hold. the. shot. ..pphhuck.
- Never thought I'd hear a James Newton Howard hard pathos style of soloist violin in Star Wars but there it was, an appropriate sendoff for boring Lady character, I suppose.
- Reva, honey, it ain't gonna happen, not even with your fidget-spinner lightsaber. It was low-key rad watching Vader play with is food yet why would he of all people deliver anything less than a killing blow? Let's hope that ever-so convenient bit of writing is justified later (not holding my breath). I'm guessing however that it's all mere setup for a showdown between Reva and Pinhead. - Once again: they've got this little girl actress for three hours, today and tomorrow, so let's just put her character in a crawlspace for the episode. - Lastly, *dramatic inhale / sigh*
Alright, yes, it was admittedly kinda sorta just maybe a little bit satisfying returning to a downtime scene in (or around) Attack of the Clones with Anakin and Obi-Wan's sparring lesson. I never needed it. I didn't ask for it. I could've lived the rest of my Star Wars fandom days perfectly happy without it. But, yes, it was a solid intermittent sequence. They cooled it proper with the acting, allowing for the two leads to use mostly their eyes and focus on body language. Hayden is still so dashing in his sword-fighting physicality. It's such a sudden rush seeing him once more in this movieverse, just how much his presence has been sorely missed this far out and for this long at sea in Disney's Star Wars, where Daisy Ridley and John Boyega's histrionics and even Adam Driver's powderkeg angst in retrospect, by comparison, all come off that much more overwrought and blandly modern. Pretenders to the throne, all of them. Hayden as Anakin is so much more the authentic Golden Age swashbuckler who can play his brood straightforward and evenly between a handsome smile, and without all the try-hard. It's, like, Wow. A good ol' fashioned Star Wars hero.
Even the score in those scenes was heightened, as if that momentary near-return to Lucas' era inspired something more romantic. I also appreciate how they didn't digitally de-age Hayden, at least not too much by my reckoning. I can't put my finger on why, exactly; it's just somehow kind of a nice meta-nod.
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Jun 15, 2022 12:59:35 GMT
The flashback was pretty spectacular, and the best thing the series has to offer so far. I think you're right, Ingram, that the return to Lucas era made for something more romantic and simply better than what the main story of the series is about. Technically the series takes place in the Lucas era, but in a space of time that he left more unexplored. The flashback to AotC's time frame brought us closer to the Lucas films, specifically the grandiosity of the prequels. Ewan and especially Hayden still got it when it comes to lightsaber fighting, and they pulled some pretty spectacular moves that resembled the Battle of the Heroes. The lightsaber fighting Obi-Wan did against the stormtroopers looked pretty weak, though. Some of the hits and laser blocking didn't even look like it connected. I noticed that last episode and here it's even worse. And something about the lightsabers doesn't look or feel right. I did not care for the rest of the episode, but I'm over the moon about that flashback and seeing good guy Anakin again. I would really like a "special edition" cut of AotC that added those flashbacks to it. It's nice seeing mre of Ewan's Obi-Wan and Hayden's Anakin just being friends. The fact that they didn't seem to deage the actors was a little weird at first. I don't know if it's out of laziness, budget reasons or some artistic choice that they didn't do that, but I actually liked seeing older looking Anakin. Maybe it's Obi-Wan's memory, where he's simultaneously imagining what Anakin would look like had he not turned.
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Jun 15, 2022 14:00:34 GMT
Cryo, you have been collecting comments and videos from YouTube, and a lot of them have been negative. But I'm seeing nothing but praise for Hayden's appearance. It's an overwhelmingly positive reception, just like he got at Celebration. It's really heartwarming to see. All these people rising up who had wanted to see more of Hayden in Star Wars. I think Hayden put Ewan to shame even with this brief appearance.  I'm still not feeling Ewan's performance, and some people have noted that his accent seems to change from scene to scene. Hayden slipped almost completely seamlessly into the role of a young man again, even matching the voice he had in AotC. But there is also a new confidence that has come to him with age. That last shot of Anakin showing a battle hardened face. I think that is interesting. Many people wanted Clone Wars era flashbacks, but I think this "Obi-Wan remembering padawan Anakin but as an older man who never turned" is more interesting. Hayden clearly gave it his all, and wanted to impress and please the fans, but didn't eschew any of his prequel mannerisms. There is so many small nuances just in those brief flashbcks that Hayden brought to the character. It's a marvel to behold. |
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 15, 2022 14:25:21 GMT
First thoughts on Part V:
What a brilliant episode! I've never been lit up so much in any Disney Lucasfilm produced material before. This was even better than the final Clone Wars season*.
Such a overwhelming leap in quality from the very dull Part IV, I can't quite believe it.
Bravo to all the actors, bravo Chow, bravo Harold.
* I rank seasons 5 and 6 much higher than 7
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Post by stampidhd280pro on Jun 15, 2022 15:10:22 GMT
With this episode i felt there was a fantastic script and an ok director. Overall though, i loved it. Might post more thoughts, after some re-watchings.
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Post by darkspine10 on Jun 15, 2022 15:16:45 GMT
Copied from my thoughts on the JCF: I really liked the reveal of Reva's true motivations. I was expecting some kind of obsession with Kenobi, but it took the smarter angle of having her secretly want to bring Anakin/Vader down and using Obi-Wan to achieve that goal. I also really liked that Vader saw through that almost immediately, leading to the fantastic duel where he was clearly toying with her the whole time. The duel-wielding bit, short as it was, was a very cool image (also was this the first use of a double-bladed lightsaber in live-action since TPM?!). I also adored how the flashbacks paralelled Anakin's flaws in the present. It wasn't the most subtle link, but it was still nice to see his established character traits from the Prequel era come back to bite him, and I like how Obi-Wan was wise to deliberately play on that aspect of him. And who am I to shirk some Attack of the Clones era nostalgia with Hayden and Ewan  I will say that apart from the stellar duels, the direction of the other action scenes like the big gunfight were a lot wearker though. There was an abundance of obnoxiois shaky-cam during the first wave that really jarred for me. Stormtroopers just do nothing for me nowadays  Also is it weird that I thought the clone troopers seen in the flashback were way too shiny? Kinda funny that I think the CG troopers in ROTS looked better, but hey, they were only on screen for like 3 seconds in this ep  This was definitely the episode that I've enjoyed most so far, and has gone the most to justifying the show as a whole. |
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Jun 15, 2022 15:25:45 GMT
Watching YouTube videos of all the flashback bits put together, and it's like a lost scene from AotC. It's brilliant and I love it. Makes me wish for a full series of Anakin and Obi-Wan pre-AotC adventures. Just two bros traveling around the galaxy, settling disputes.
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 15, 2022 16:19:14 GMT
For those of you applicable, consider submitting a question to this webinar which begins at 5:45 p.m. in Eastern Time (US and Canada).
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 15, 2022 16:41:26 GMT
Watching YouTube videos of all the flashback bits put together, and it's like a lost scene from AotC. It's brilliant and I love it. Makes me wish for a full series of Anakin and Obi-Wan pre-AotC adventures. Just two bros traveling around the galaxy, settling disputes.
Yeah, that is definitely fertile territory. There's 10 years there. As far as I know, it's only been briefly covered in one low-key comic series so far, you may have come across it.
They've already started diving into that timeframe for Padmé with the novel Queen's Shadow, which Subtext Mining has given a generous review elsewhere (I can't recall the thread). It traces her stepping down as Queen of Naboo to becoming a Galactic Senator. They've now done a trilogy of Padmé novels, believe it or not, with the most recent one taking place during the Clone War period. The second one was a prequel to TPM.
They've recently put out a Anakin-Obi-Wan novel aptly titled Brotherhood. It's an immediate sequel to AOTC, so it takes place at the early stages of the Clone Wars era, and, according to the author, connects the dots to the animated series, which you'll remember starts sometime several months into the war. Whilst I've yet to get the novel, I am hearing some very positive reviews, such as from Star Wars Theory. I would hope they would do another two novels and make it an Anakin trilogy. Of course, better yet would be a live-action or animated series of some form. You would have to look at recasting in the case of the former though (teenage Anakin).
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jtn90
Ambassador
Posts: 66
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Post by jtn90 on Jun 15, 2022 17:05:51 GMT
First of all Hayden was amazing in this episode, but this is the comments that I already saw it coming:  I didn't notice any diference in his acting or dialogue that makes him better here than in the prequels. But whats up wiht people that no matter how a prequel related product show how proud, unashamed or shows honor and makes tribute to the prequels, they are not the prequels or made by George Lucas so aparently the prequels haters are free to weaponing these products agains them. Talking about the episode I liked it better than the last one, and maybe the seconf and third but not the first one, and I'm glad they teased a return to Tatooine and a focus to Luke.I liked the flashback as many of you, as I said Anakin charater is untouched, treaated with respect, it seems to be set before Attack of the clones as Anakin hasn't the robotic hand, the recreation of hte prequel aesthitic is well done but it lacks the rich colors of AOTC,but is undestandable it's different directors and vision. It's me or it felt like Obi Wan made Anakin about to cry at the end?, he gave him a good advice but I felt like Anakin thought that Obi Wan was more dissapointed that proud for disarm him. Wich is in line with the prequels, with Obi Wan having good intentions but not thinking on Anakin feelings. By the way is seems that aparently you can survive being stabed by a lightsaber, even if Qui Gon died of that same thing, I could undestand the Grand inquisitor suriviving because the head canon that he is an aliendm so he maybe has another anatomy, but now Reva, I guess Vader didn't stab her in a vital organ, but It should be more clear. It's just weird not bad per se. I liked how darth Vader didn't bothered to use his own lightsaber with her and basically he beat the cr*p out of her effortlessly,althought just like in Episode IX and The Force Unleashed don't know what to think about the ability of catching a ship mid air with the force. Yoda could lift Luke's ship but it was off. He knowing Reva intantions gives a different meaning to Vader's talk to her in episode 3: "I have been watching you, Third Sister. I know what it is you seek." |
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 15, 2022 17:14:22 GMT
An older actor playing a younger version of his character isn't exactly anything unusual....
The actor is noticeably older looking than his character is in this spin-off film too, and yet nobody got hiccups over it, and neither did the filmmakers stress themselves out on de-ageing: |
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 15, 2022 18:23:06 GMT
Notes on the fifth episode
~ The episode is a deliberate homage to its namesake, Episode V, and you can see all the parallels to Hoth.
~ Anything with Coruscant in it makes me happy. I loved that opened shot, it was excitement level I hadn't felt in years and years of Star Wars. It was an emotional connection that I simply cannot get out of The Mandalorian, as much as I may admire what Filoni and Favreau are doing there.
~ I did not expect a AOTC era flashback. If we were getting a flashback, we all thought it had to be in the interlude of Episodes II and III, ie Clone War era. Like Leia instead of Luke, this was a pleasant surprise, and I'm glad Harold and co were thinking outside the box. A sparring session was pretty cool, it's something the characters would have regularly done, but it's weaved together nicely so that it further the realtime story.
~ General Kenobi: the Obi-Wan we all know and love, commanding his fighters from the secret base. It brought back strong memories of The Clone Wars, mixed together with a TESB style setting. Thankfully our hero is actually present here, unlike the TLJ con-artistry.
~ Very well acted scene between Reva and Obi-Wan by the base entrance. A dramatic improvement over the awful scene between her and Leia in the last instalment.
~ Yes, we could all see it coming that Reva was present for the storming of the Jedi Temple, but as I said some pages back, if surprise is all you care for, then Rian Johnson is your reward. There's nothing wrong with Star Wars not being 4-D chess.
~ I really liked O'Shea's character. For once a key supporting character didn't feel in the way. He would fit straight into TCW very nicely.
~ I'm relieved the former imperial lady didn't become a love interest of Obi-Wan. There's a scene here where it really looks like they might be going that way. She later dies, sacrificing herself for the cause, which was well handled by the director.
~ Leia was good. While her screentime is diminished, it's fair to say she's had a great run so far. It's very cute with the mini droid.
~ Music finally becomes noticeable. It wasn't doing much for me in Part II-IV, it was more effective here, the Obi-Wan theme became relevant.
~ No stupid lines that took me out of the drama. This was a serious concern, given what we had last week.
~ Like in the 3rd episode, the dialogue for Vader all felt natural.
~ I also enjoyed the writing for Obi-Wan. The mentally disfigured Obi-Wan retreats, as we saw the former general re-emerge. The lines where he refers to Vader as Anakin were pretty touching to say the least.
~AOTC-esque, Master-Padowan style dialogue between Obi-Wan and Anakin in the Jedi Temple scene. They took a lot of risks by flashing back this far, you have to admire them for being brave with the writing here; I'll admit, I wouldn't have done it. It would have been far easier to write material from the battlefields of the Clone Wars - ready made templates already exists.
~ Lots of shaky-cam and not enough alien diversity in the base are the only ways I can nitpick. I can get over them though, they're small things.
~ I love that Bail cares about Luke Skywalker. I mean, why wouldn't he? He's the son of his dead friend and close Senate associate, Padmé. We'd already learned that Obi-Wan cares about Leia, so it's like poetry, it rhymes.
It's looking like an A from me.
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Post by Seeker of the Whills on Jun 15, 2022 18:47:21 GMT
I can't gush over the flashback enough, it's a work of art. How it opens on a Coruscant day with clear blue sky and we see the back of Anakin, padawan braid and all, looking out wistfully at the horizon. How the music swells for the reveal and Obi-Wan's "Ah, there you are" as Anakin turns to face us. It's like a dream of seeing an old friend long gone again. "Through the Force, things you will see. Other places. The future. The past. Old friends long gone." The Force is strong with this series, sometimes. This was the best part so far, and it made me more emotional than I anticipated. The way it's shot too is much better than the other action scenes in the series, perhaps because Hayden and Ewan are so immaculate in doing the choreography that it can't be screwed up. You just point the camera at them and watch these two masters do their work.
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Post by stampidhd280pro on Jun 15, 2022 18:52:20 GMT
Nobody's talking about lying with the bodies? Cryo, you typing up a short novel, or what?
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 15, 2022 19:18:58 GMT
Nobody's talking about lying with the bodies? Cryo, you typing up a short novel, or what?
We're like the bumbling inquistors, anxiously awaiting the arrival of Lord Vader.
Also:
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Post by Ingram on Jun 15, 2022 19:42:56 GMT
First of all Hayden was amazing in this episode, but this is the comments that I already saw it coming: I didn't notice any diference in his acting or dialogue that makes him better here than in the prequels. But whats up wiht people that no matter how a prequel related product show how proud, unashamed or shows honor and makes tribute to the prequels, they are not the prequels or made by George Lucas so aparently the prequels haters are free to weaponing these products agains them. "Also u can just feel how natural Hayden's acting is here without bad dialogues."
— Random Dipshit-Comment Generator
If anything, it better constitutes the chosen sophistications of the Prequels. In this latest episode an older Hayden was indeed effortless; in the PT he was artless, differences being one in the same in terms of its affect. That's why I think in both instances he shines so much brighter -- truer -- as a classicalist Star Wars hero than every other young actor Disney has since thrown at us.
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Post by ArchdukeOfNaboo on Jun 15, 2022 20:03:45 GMT
First of all Hayden was amazing in this episode, but this is the comments that I already saw it coming:
Indeed, it was either going to be that that load of codswallop, or something like:
If you'll give me enough time, I can bring up the quotes from this forum where we foresee all this happening.
That said, however, I do not see much of these kind of comments so far, JTN. It's no longer 2014, it's 2022, and the factions have changed considerably, with the Fandom Menace tending to point their spears elsewhere than Christensen. Only the sadists within the OT fanboys would come after such a harmless actor, whose always been polite and gracious with everyone he's worked with. |
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Post by Darkslayer on Jun 15, 2022 22:01:38 GMT
Amazing episode, best of the series so far. I am extremely happy with it. Only criticism is no John Williams music. Get Natalie Holt off of the show, I am sorry, but you gotta respect what came before.
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Post by stampidhd280pro on Jun 15, 2022 22:05:50 GMT
You know, I'd rather filler music than Williams rehash. Gotta save the big guns for the films.
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I'm still not feeling Ewan's performance, and some people have noted that his accent seems to change from scene to scene. Hayden slipped almost completely seamlessly into the role of a young man again, even matching the voice he had in AotC. But there is also a new confidence that has come to him with age. That last shot of Anakin showing a battle hardened face. I think that is interesting. Many people wanted Clone Wars era flashbacks, but I think this "Obi-Wan remembering padawan Anakin but as an older man who never turned" is more interesting. Hayden clearly gave it his all, and wanted to impress and please the fans, but didn't eschew any of his prequel mannerisms. There is so many small nuances just in those brief flashbcks that Hayden brought to the character. It's a marvel to behold.
Also is it weird that I thought the clone troopers seen in the flashback were way too shiny? Kinda funny that I think the CG troopers in ROTS looked better, but hey, they were only on screen for like 3 seconds in this ep 
